Jim Rutherford’s Past Successes Open Door To Current Criticism
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 7:00 AM EST
144 comments
It is human nature to look for a scapegoat when things go wrong. You need look no further than politics.
Americans voted for change last November by electing Barack Obama and many other Democrats into office, only to reverse course earlier this month and insert many GOP candidates into public office.
When it comes to hockey, a puzzling fall to last place in the NHL leads to a lot of finger-pointing. Ask the Carolina Hurricanes.
Spotty goaltending, lack of scoring, defensive miscues, coaching errors, penalties and injuries have all contributed to Carolina’s downward spiral into the abyss of the league standings. But even when the problems are so numerous and widespread, usually the spotlight of blame is shone on a select few.
Prior to injuries, franchise cornerstones Eric Staal and Cam Ward were both under fire from fans who expected more out of the team’s superstars. Captain Rod Brind’Amour’s struggles have led some to suggest he should hang up his skates or vacate his captaincy. Coach Paul Maurice, who masterfully steered a wayward team to the Eastern Conference Finals last season, has been unable to stop the bleeding in the defensive zone or find ways to help his squad generate offense — they rank dead last in both goals for and goals against.
But the criticism that deserves the most analysis is the suggestion by some that GM Jim Rutherford is not only to blame for the incredibly disappointing season, but should pay for his mistakes with his job.
Rutherford’s success as a GM is documented: he is one of seven active GMs to have won a Stanley Cup, and one of just six to have made more than one trip to the Finals. (Brian Burke, the general manager of the Toronto Maple Leafs, has done it once, winning a Stanley Cup in 2007 with the Anaheim Ducks)
Furthermore, two of the aforementioned six are a decade or two removed from making a run to the final two (Glen Sather, the Rangers GM, last did so in 1988 when his Oilers dynasty ended with the last of four Stanley Cups; Montreal GM Bob Gainey did his damage with the Minnesota North Stars/Dallas Stars, sandwiching losses in the Finals in 1991 and 2000 around a win in 1999).
That leaves a pretty exclusive club: Lou Lamoriello (New Jersey) and Ken Holland (Detroit) — arguably the top executives in the game — have each won three Stanley Cups and lost in one finals as general manager of their clubs, relative newcomer Ray Shero has guided the Penguins to a final in 2008-09 and a title last season, and Rutherford, who won the Cup in 2006 after losing to the Red Wings in 2002.
While Shero’s roster tweaking certainly helped lead Pittsburgh to back-to-back trips to the finals, he inherited a roster chock full of talent (Sidney Crosby, Evgeni Malkin and Marc-Andre Fleury were all in place when Shero took over), and he has yet been challenged with rebuilding a team.
On the flip side, Rutherford — few people ever, for that matter — simply does not compare with Lamoriello and Holland. The latter two have managed to guide their teams to playoff after playoff, be it through a spending free-for-all era or the more recent salary cap world. Since coming to Raleigh, the Hurricanes have been postseason outsiders more times (six) than participators (five), with another year without playoffs seeming more likely by the day.
It is fair to ask: Would you rather have a perennial contender that falls short, like the Sharks, Flyers or Flames, or a team like Carolina that has had a few dramatic runs toward glory coupled with some numbingly poor seasons? And are either — the good or the bad — mainly due to Rutherford’s performance?
The Hockey News’ Adam Proteau think Rutherford’s successes outweigh the failures, especially in a parity-filled NHL.
"I think the helter-skelter play you've seen season-to-season from the Canes the last little while is more of an indication of how thin the line really is today between winning and losing in the NHL," Proteau said. "The Flyers, for instance, also were able to turn around a cruddy season just a year later. And Anaheim right now looks as if they'll be in the lottery race this year, so soon after looking so dominant at the end of last season."
But the peaks don't necessarily make the valleys any more bearable.
"I can understand the frustration," said James Mirtle, who covers the Maple Leafs for Toronto’s The Globe & Mail and writes for SB Nation on From The Rink. "That’s what happens with success, right? Look at Colorado."
Proteau agrees that success leads to heightened expectations.
"He has been THN's Executive of the Year twice since I've been at [The Hockey News], and for good reason," Proteau said. "Look at some of the franchises that came both before and after the Canes/Whalers came into being, and you'll see that many of them have (a) no Stanley Cups and (b) no Cup Final appearances. That Jim has a couple to his name (and very nearly another one last season) speaks to a patience and focus that has served his employer well. And doing so on a so-called 'budget team' makes the achievement all the more impressive."
Rutherford’s bargain-bin shopping is a big part of that budgeted success, a tactic that has worked more often than it has not. Also, his unending loyalty to several players and coaches is an admirable trait that has both benefited and hurt the team at times. For example, the return of Erik Cole and Maurice helped spark the team to the conference finals last season, but retaining both for two and three years, respectively, hasn’t yet yielded the same results. There are more: Ron Francis’ return to the franchise — good; Josef Vasicek’s — not so good; Matt Cullen’s return — good; Aaron Ward’s re-acquisition — so far, not good. The list goes on.
Greg Wyshynski, who edits Puck Daddy, thinks Rutherford showed shrewd negotiating skills with free agents this offseason, but overlooked some weaknesses — including re-acquiring Ward to fill the defensive holes left by the departures of Dennis Seidenberg and Anton Babchuk.
"While I was really supportive of the pimp hand last summer in talking down guys like [Chad] LaRose, it's clear that some upgrades — like on the blue line — probably needed a little more attention than they received," Wyshynski said. "Last year's team was propelled by a number of career years and an amazing execution of the Maurice system. There needed to be a few upgrades to keep things moving forward."
While Proteau believes Rutherford is one of the game’s best, Wyshynski isn’t so sure.
"I think he does a solid job, but the Hurricanes carry a lot of payroll for a team in that market, you know?" Wyshynski said.
Mirtle was also reluctant to group Rutherford among the game’s elite, saying, "I think he's probably in the middle somewhere."
Which raises the question: if we conceded, for a moment, that Rutherford is not among the best GMs in the game, does he bring value beyond what happens on the ice?
"Absolutely," Proteau said. "As one of the longest-tenured GMs in the game, he is widely respected by his peers. As such, he can stress issues that are important not only to the game in a larger sense, but that will affect the success of the Canes in the long run, and he will be listened to in a way that a rookie GM may not."
Mirtle added that Rutherford is one of the more visible GMs, especially for a small market team.
"He has a lot of influence around the league, and I think that’s a good thing," Mirtle said. "He’s on the radio [in Toronto] a lot. I don’t ever hear the other [GMs] from down South: Florida, Atlanta, Phoenix."
The mainstream media often looks to Rutherford for opinions on important league topics, the most recent being the debate on headshots.
Proteau and The Hockey News are part of that, often seeking out Rutherford’s opinion. A recent example is the magazine’s Nov. 16 cover story titled "The Defensemen Issue." Rutherford was one of six panelists — along with Sharks GM Doug Wilson, Red Wings assistant GM Jim Nill, former GMs Neil Smith and Craig Button, and Mark Seidel, Central Scouting's chief scout — asked to name the NHL's best defensemen in a variety of categories. Proteau said Rutherford’s experience — coupled with accessibility — make him a valuable source.
"Age and experience definitely is a factor in our relationship with Jim," Proteau said. "He knows the financial realities of the business, and he has served on enough committees and boards over the years that he is up to speed on virtually every issue of prominence. But it's also about him making himself available to reporters, and conveying ideas and concepts in a manner that all fans can understand. Jim is quite adept at both those things."
But does experience and visibility translate to worth?
"He clearly has a voice on the league level and the respect of his peers," Wyshynski said. "How does that translate to value? I'm not sure. He's not exactly hurting for trading partners, for whatever that's worth. In the end, he's the team president for Carolina, which isn't exactly an Original Six franchise. It reminds me of my time covering high school sports: The massive secondary schools in the suburbs would always have more influences than the rural schools. It's just how it works."
The publicity and attention that Rutherford brings to to the franchise — and done without the sometimes overwhelming bravado of Burke — is surely more than most, if not all, of the Sun Belt teams. But more importantly, Rutherford’s teams have proven that, at times, they can be among the league’s elite. But can the long-time GM — facing a future with young players instead of the veterans he employed coming out of the lockout — work his magic again?
"If the team is going to bottom out, is this the guy you want to [rebuild] it?" Mirtle said. "I could see why people would ask that."
Still, there's a reason why Rutherford's name was mentioned in Toronto's GM search last year.
"I don’t think he was one of the first people sought out, but you have to give the guy credit," Mirtle said. "I think the Leafs were looking for a guy that has won a Cup, and he has. … It gives Rutherford something that makes him desirable. And that’s probably why he gets such a long rope."
And in the end that's what it comes down to: Rutherford has found a way to not only win a Stanley Cup, but guide his team to the finals one other time and the conference finals last season. All the publicity in the world can't overshadow wins.
"I think the best way he gives the Canes value is by the on-ice results, and the fact that a season like their current one can be met with such widespread disdain by their fans is a good indication of what people have come to expect from the franchise," Proteau said. "Contrast that with the likes of the Panthers, Thrashers and Coyotes, and you see why that matters so much."
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WOW Cory! You’ve set a new standard. And given that JR is center-stage during this 4-day mini-break, it’s great to have this background on the man. Thanks for the big effort and the subtle writing.
Hurricanes Hockey:
Never for the faint of heart.
Nor for the weak of stomach.
Oh yeah.. great article Cory! Definatley wowed me!
by 3yrsnoplayoffs? on Dec 2, 2009 7:48 AM EST up reply actions
Live talk with Rutherford on the radio this morning.
Also – for those who will be near a radio (or can stream online) this morning around 8:30, the Canes tweeted this yesterday:
Jim Rutherford will guest on 620 The Buzz’s morning show with Adam and Joe Wednesday at 8:30 a.m. Streaming: http://espntriangle.com/
(I’ll post a link here for latecomers afterward, when it goes up)
Hurricanes Hockey:
Never for the faint of heart.
Nor for the weak of stomach.
Thank HM!!! I’ll be at work, so I won’t get to hear the stream.
by 3yrsnoplayoffs? on Dec 2, 2009 7:50 AM EST up reply actions
I haven’t seen the link for Rutherford this morning, yet, but found a great discussion with Forslund at the 99.9 Audio Vault, recorded yesterday morning. A little dated – only 20 hours later, but I always like hearing the dulcet tones of John discussing the Canes as a team and the individuals, and only moreso when I need some comfort.
Hurricanes Hockey:
Never for the faint of heart.
Nor for the weak of stomach.
And here's the link to Rutherford this morning
Hurricanes Hockey:
Never for the faint of heart.
Nor for the weak of stomach.
The way he talked about guys on the final year of the contract was also surprising. Sounds like he’s going to let all of them go.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
I like Corvo but not sure if he’ll stay either. I got to go look at who’s contract is up again, thats the ones he is going to try and deal.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
Cullen, Corvo, Whitney, Wallin, Ward, Leighton, Yelle … ummm … that’s the top of my head.
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 2:35 PM EST up reply actions
Where does Cullen fit in with Staal, Sutter, and Jokinen? I like Cullen now, but what he can bring back in return and what will be on the roster I’d have to say it would be better for both parties if they parted ways.
5 seconds left.
Do you believe in miracles?
YES!!
I’d rather we keep Jokinen at wing and use Cullen in a similar role as now. That’s significant depth if you have Staal/Cullen/Sutter as a 1-2-3 punch.
I’d rather have Sutter as #2 center because I’ve noticed he plays better the longer he’s out there, More minutes the better.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
I think Cullen and Sutter could be used interchangeably depending on who’s on a roll that night, etc.
This team is likely not got to be competitive this year or next. Cullen is 33 (just turned on Nov 2). In two years he’ll be 35. By then Zac Dalpe should be in the big league, not to mention what the pic the team can get for trading Cullen can return.
If he wants to come back in the off-season (after being traded at the deadline) that would be okay I guess, but I’d rather a young player had that time to mature.
With Staal and Sutter my guess is that 1 and 2 center are taken care of for the next five or six years. Cullen just doesn’t fit long term.
5 seconds left.
Do you believe in miracles?
YES!!
Cullen not sure we have room for him either.
Whitney is worth $ but age might be a factor.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
I think Whitney would be fine for a year or two. He certainly doesn’t show any signs of slowing down. Whether he’d be willing to accept that length of a deal, I don’t know.
You could have said the same thing about Rod a couple of years ago, that he’d be good for a few more, especially the way he kept himself in shape. But when you get that age, you get injured you may never realy make it back.
I’d keep Whitney if we can sign him for one year contracts.
by CanesFanFromLI on Dec 2, 2009 2:43 PM EST up reply actions
Even worse, you could have and most did say the same about Aaron Ward before this season…
I am 100% for letting all the old guys go, the great teams emerging in the NHL are the ones going young and fast. I’m sure that everyone would love to keep the fan favorites Whitney, Corvo, and Cullen however the reality is that kind of thinking got us into this mess in the first place. You have to give up decent players to get back new decent players. Everyone will fall in love with the new guys in a few games, don’t be so afraid of change.
Rock and a hard place with this one. Walker is as tough a guy as you’ll find but his injuries are a concern. If he goes, do you then need to keep Conboy to fill the tough guy role?
I’d keep Walker for a year and let Conboy go (or sign him to a two way deal).
Walker is going to be a tough call, Conboy will definitely be gone. The thing is we all like alot of players but you just have to let them go to make changes. This group just doesn’t play well together.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
I know. That’s why I’m glad I’m not JR because I’d have a hard time separating personal feelings from business dealings (although we may now see that so does he).
I’d put serious thought into resigning Whitney and Corvo; then I’d put semi-serious thought into resigning Cullen and Walker. The rest of them can adios their way out of Raleigh.
Although the way some of them are playing it will be easier to let them go. Rosies play this year is a mystery, even before his contract year he was always better than this.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
by canescup on Dec 2, 2009 3:07 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Wow, wishing LaRose is injured. What a terrible person. ):>)
greaticepectations.blogspot.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 2, 2009 3:18 PM EST up reply actions
Whitney and Corvo only make sense on a team competing this year and next. Whitney’s spot can be taken by Boychuk and Bowman (and maybe Hall or Seguin). Corvo’s spot has Rodney and McBain written all over it (and maybe Carson).
Ice time is better served on younger players. Money is better saved.
5 seconds left.
Do you believe in miracles?
YES!!
Scott Walker is NOT a tough call
23 games missed two seasons ago, 41 games missed last year, and 8 already this year. He has a long history of injuries and will be 37 at the start of next season. You do not sign a player that old who has proven that he cannot stay healthy.
As for Whitney: 38 years old at the start of next season.
It’s time to start saying goodbye to the old guys who are at the tale ends of their careers and transitioning in young players.
The only UFAs I’d entertaining re-signing are Corvo and Cullen, who will be 33 and probably have at least a few good seasons left in them.
Walkers OT goal in game seven last year should get him another year. I know thats crazy but man that was sweet, I got to go look at that again.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
Yes, it is crazy. That’s how you end up in situations where we are now. Paying people to “reward” past performances (in this case, a single goal) instead of paying them for how they will perform during the contract.
Scott Walker will be 37 at the start of next season and cannot stay healthy. Time to let him go.
I disagree. Kahz is right. Past performance shouldn’t weigh the team down. Like with Kaberle or Wallin. I mean if we’re trying to go for the long term, we should develop a team identity and go for it. I mean those all-important goals look great on a resume, and I hope those guys stay in the NHL (sorry Frank). Walker I’m still on the fence about tho. Such a good grinder that we need. Prolly a 4th liner by now tho.
I totally get your point about Walker, but I feel like I have to at least put out the fact that most of the injuries (at least last year) weren’t “wear and tear” injuries that indicate a body breaking down.
He missed a lot of time with a concussion because of Cooke’s dirty play. That could happen to anyone. Before that he broke his hand defending Cullen (who is also injury prone). I’d be hesitant to resign him long term, but if we’re looking at one year for a reasonable amount (much less than he’s making now) I’d think about it.
http://www.hockeydb.com/ihdb/stats/pdisplay.php?pid=5619
He has a long history of injuries. It’s not going to change when he’s a small guy who “plays big” and his 37.
We are the WORST TEAM IN THE LEAGUE, yet at least one person here has suggested we sign everybody but Yelle and Ward. We are also the OLDEST TEAM IN THE LEAGUE, yet people want Walker and Whitney back at ages 37 and 38.
I mean, seriously…Tim Conboy? He makes league minimum and nobody wanted him for free on waivers. He sucks. He brings nothing to the ice outside of some physical play, which is completely negated by the fact that he can’t play hockey at all. I remember reading posts from Rats fans who were DISAPPOINTED that Conboy got sent down because that would mean they would have to watch him play.
Here’s why the team has such a good record with Conboy in the lineup: most of his time spent as a Hurricane was after JR made trades late in the season to improve the team—Corvo in ‘07-’08 and Cole+Jokinen in ‘08-’09.
I think I'm getting a bunch of different responses in one post here
*I agree Walker has a long history of injuries. I believe I said as much in the post you replied to. I referenced the fact that last season’s injuries weren’t necessarily injuries you could point to as being due to age or fragile.
*I never said to resign Ward or Yelle. That’s something you need to take up with that person.
*Next year we likely won’t be the oldest team in the league. JR has already said as much. It would be nice to have some veteran presence in the lineup, especially for the young guys coming up from Albany (keep in mind the core of the group will be mid 20’s and still have some maturing to do of their own). FWIW I’d pick Whitney over Walker to do that. Again, I don’t want to sign either one to 4 year deals. That would be foolish, but I don’t see a problem in signing them (Whitney especially) to a one year deal.
*I said I wouldn’t bring Conboy back. I don’t think he’s a necessary part of our lineup. And I don’t put much weight on his “effect” on our winning percentage. I was merely pointing it out as an interesting fact.
*The fact of the matter is that Walker has a long history of injuries. It doesn’t matter how they happened or if they were flukes or what they indicate. They happen almost every year to him. He cannot be relied upon to stay in the lineup. We already gambled once on him. Let’s not do it again.
*"yet at least one person here has suggested we sign everybody but Yelle and Ward." — everybody besides Yelle. And yes, I wasn’t referring to.
*Oh, so we won’t be the oldest next year. We’ll just be one of the oldest in this scenario. There are plenty of veteran players signed already for next year and most of the mid-20s core will have been the league for at least 5 seasons.
*So I guess we’re not trading Whitney at the deadline for a pick/prospect/young player that could help this team in the long term? And not only that, but we’re re-signing him with money that could be used to upgrade the team. All to hang on to a 38-year old winger who could very well hit a steep decline like A.Ward and Brind’amour have. And even if he has another good season, that will probably be his last at a high level.
:shrugs: That’s the way you feel, I feel differently. Yes, the team needs to get younger and faster, but it doesn’t have to turn into the youngest team in the league overnight. Our 25 year olds still have a bit of maturing, and learning, to do. My point is that it may be nice to have someone with Whitney’s experience and leadership to kind of keep them pointed in the right direction and keep things in perspective (he’s been through it all before); especially since he’s still playing the game at an elite level.
I don’t want to sign Whitney to a long-term deal, but I don’t see the harm in at least looking into a short term deal (1 year, reasonable money) if he’s interested. If he’s not, well then he will have to move on.
I’m not a fan of Conboy, I see him as dead weight when he’s in the line up.
And for a ‘tough guy’ he’s not all that great a fighter.
by CanesFanFromLI on Dec 2, 2009 4:35 PM EST up reply actions
Same here, but the team has a ridiculous winning percentage when he’s in the lineup compared to when he’s not.
It hasn’t helped this year … just saying.
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 9:52 PM EST up reply actions
Now Cory, has anything helped this year? LOL
Of the 11 games he’s played in this year, we’re 2-6-3. 7 out of 15 points? That’s almost 47% of our current point total (46. 66666%). I don’t know the numbers for previous seasons, but it’s there.
It’s also a 22.2 winning percentage.
Matt, IMO, is one of the streakiest guys in the league. He has the ability to dominate a game (something I don’t personally think even Whitney can do), but he can disappear (offensively) for 10 game stretches.
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 10:24 PM EST up reply actions
it’s clear I’m losing my mind. Disregard everything I’ve said.
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 10:34 PM EST up reply actions
I just listened to this. Were those the little Rutherford’s yelling in the background at the very beginning? I guess I imagined him doing this from the office.
He sounds overwhelmingly calm. Maybe it’s an act for the media or maybe he really is, but it’s nice to hear that he’s not going to do something out of panic.
Also surprised he used a land line (the other person picking up the phone and dialing)
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 2:23 PM EST up reply actions
elskling and I clearly heard a crying baby in the background at the beginning, just as he was answering a tough question. Tough working conditions, all right, and yet he barely faltered in his answer.
I was thinking more toddler aged, but no, he didn’t react at all. Although he was probably waving his arms in the classic parent “get away from me can’t you see I’m on the phone?” gesture.
he’s got a little one … don’t recall what age, maybe 5 or younger?
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 2:34 PM EST up reply actions
Rutherford
There are few jobs I would most not want than to be the GM for the Hurricanes. This season is a prime example as far as I am concerned. The team under performs and some people want management’s heads to roll. It is as if 2005-2006 didn’t exist or that this team, with the exception of one starter (Seidenberg) and one mostly starter (Babchuk), didn’t go to the Eastern Conference finals — only to lose to the Stanley Cup winners.
The core team is actually quite young, healthy and ready for the new NHL. Rutherford’s interview contains a telling statement: "If you take our core guys and added a star player immediately out of the draft, that team could take a huge step forward," said Rutherford. "If it ended today, that’s where we’d be, but we owe it to our fans to win games."
The addition of Taylor Hall, Tyler Seguin, or Kirill Kabanov, and the end of the tenure of Aaron Ward and Wallin, dramatically improves the team. Albany has some excellent talent — and in fact the Hurricanes probably have more talent in Albany ready to play this year than they have roster spots even if Rutherford could move everybody he wanted to move.
Many people were like me and were pleased with the addition of Aaron Ward — whose incredibly bad play has been a huge disappointment and burden to the team. I thought Kostopoulos was an excellent addition, and still think he is fine. Yelle seemed like a great choice for a one year deal; and after a horrible start, he has improved. Alberts seems to be fine in his role as physical stay at home defender. LaRose’s re-signing was welcomed by most, including me, and I certainly didn’t foresee LaRose faltering this way. I thought Sutter deserved to play from day one, but I think the idea of being cautious with Sutter’s development makes sense.
As far as I am concerned, I know the Hurricanes need another franchise player. Given the team’s financial constraints, the Hurricanes have to build from the draft. We all know that to get a top 5 draft pick, we first have to suffer through the agony of an ugly, pitiful year. That’s the gauntlet we have to run. We are only about a third of the way through the swamp; but it is simply a matter tenacity. The payoff in the end will be huge for the teams, the organization, and the fans.
I think this year can be summarized as Jim Rutherford took a calculated gamble that his veterans had one more year of a solid Stanley Cup Run in them before he would need to rebuild with youth. His veterans let him down, let the team down, let themselves down, and let the fans down. The consequence was the horrible year that the Hurricanes organization desperately needed to move from a team that battles each year to make the playoffs into a team with sufficient talent on the ice to be a top six team on a consistent basis.
Jim Rutherford is a superb chess player. He creates win-win situations for the Hurricanes and does so in subtle ways that are often overlooked or not understood. In this case, if his gamble worked, the Hurricanes make another deep run into the playoffs; and if his gamble doesn’t work, he gets to add the superstar forward he knows the team desperately needs for its long term health.
by abramsdoug on Dec 2, 2009 7:49 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
Wow A.Dog. That was a really really good post.
by caniacgirl on Dec 2, 2009 8:41 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
I do think Chad’s faltering is more about battling through injury. At least I hope so.
SISU
by LTD on Dec 2, 2009 8:58 AM EST up reply actions
Superb post. No quibble with any of your observations, assessments, or conclusions.
Although, unlike you, I would love to have his job…if nothing else, just to keep Paladin 6’s hands off my team. :-D
First rate stuff, as always, Cory. JR is one of the best in alot of ways, and very average in others. He has a keen eye for reclamation projects ( though not a perfect eye ), has done a good job of creating an “inviting market” for UFA’s, and has proven to be a great asset in guiding the game.
Where he has fallen flat has been his ability to make the small tweaks to keep a competitive squad competitive.
"Inviting market"
To me that’s an important point about the “inviting market”.
‘Canes are not big players in the UFA sweepstakes. But Raleigh’s come a long ways from the days of K.Primeau and G.Roberts leaving to be in more traditional hockey towns. JR may have chased a few away but he deserves some credit for the generally positive image.
Carolina Hurricanes...2011 Stanley Cup Champions
by drifterscape on Dec 2, 2009 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
Want to give us some highlights? Please!? :)
by caniacgirl on Dec 2, 2009 8:51 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
FWIW, kinda typing as I was listening so this is choppy…
Making it clear… we’re not quitting the season. Traditionally we’ve been a good second half team. We owe it to our fans to try to put a winning and entertaining product on the ice. Still believes in the makeup and character of the team and it will still come out at some point. Question is will it be too late.
Regarding the Mo must go signs… understands where the fans are coming from. Not going to make a coaching decision based on half a season. Doesn’t believe that’s where the problem is. Remember it’s not one person coaching is a team of four. Yes there are things they can do better but some players have underperformed but that’s more on the players.
Using the Waiver wire as a motivator… there will come a point in time but will be more to clear the deck for next year or relieve salary, not as much as a motivator. Will use it but not sure when.
Criticism coming my way is deserved… taking it as a positive about a passionate hockey market. Still dealing with after-effects of SCF year in terms of long-term contracts (which he does not complain about), knew he was giving more at the time and needed to (read into that what you will).
Regarding the elephant in the room, Rod Brind’Amour… Rod Brind’Amour has been a great leader and player, been through tough years, acknowledge his play is dropping off, he has a great respect for what he has done, and that situation will run its course.
SISU
by LTD on Dec 2, 2009 8:56 AM EST up reply actions
You rock LTD! Thanks!
I think JR is having just as hard a time with this as we are. The stress must be unreal at this point.
by caniacgirl on Dec 2, 2009 10:10 AM EST via mobile up reply actions
Also heard this interview, so let me see if I can augment LTD’s very good coverage with a few additional nuances:
re: coaching change – JR said he understands the fan reactions and the “Mo must go” signs. Says he’s a fan of other sport teams, and when they’re doing poorly he has the same reaction. LOL!
re: waiver wire as a tool – not only to clear salary and spots, but says that players always think “well, if it doesn’t work out here, there’s always some other team.” Said it’s always eye-opening when they learn that 29 other teams don’t want them. Also noted that other GM’s now know that player is available, so may call to say “I can’t take all the salary, so you’ll have to take something back to lower the hit” . Also noted that the re-entry waiver (splitting salary with someone) would free up significant money. Noted that with declining attendance (which he noted was understandable) that some adjustments to salary budget would have to be made, plus they want to free up roster spots to begin the transition to youth earlier than originally planned.
re: long-term contracts (and Brind’Amour’s in particular) – he volunteered that contracts from the Stanley Cup win were still affecting them. Noted that Kaberle had been bought out and that Brind’Amour’s contract would “run its course” (carefully chosen words, was my take). Said he was fully aware that he was doing a bit more than was necessary at the time. Seems very content with where those contracts are (which just supports my contention that at least Brind’Amour’s was more of a win-win contract extension at the time, with improved cash flow for the org as an objective) and how they will play out.
Talked a bit about Brind’Amour’s plus/minus as being indicative that it was a faster game than ever and that those without excellent skating skills were at a disadvantage. Still, lots of respect for what he has accomplished in his career and seemed content with how things will “play out”. Slightly discounted the plus/minus by pointing out that Brind’Amour was on the ice for five empty net goals, since he’s out there in that situation, and that in one game in particular (Pittsburgh), he was not responsible for 4 minuses that came his way.
Again want to emphasize LTD’s first paragraph re: JR’s pledge to the fans this team would improve in short order (may have even said something like “within a month or two”) and be playing entertaining and winning hockey later this season.
Quitting season… hmmm yeah, Canes are sure capable to deliver a few great shows after Olimpics, but it will not save the season… but at least some good hockey to enjoy.
Mo – these signs based not only on this season but his past record (not only with Canes)… your call here
Waiver – why not? Even JR himself seems to going to use it if I understood it right
Rod – I believe noone dares say anything bad about his past, but it was his past. Great past. Tons of respect for it. But now the team needs real leadership which Rod probably already cannot deliver. It is a tough call for him, he knows it… Yeah… I can imagine how he suffers… but it is just time…
All above is my personal opinion.
Thanks,
Andy_S
Actually I was thinking more along the lines of where we keep the good liquor than the cookies, but that will work too! LOL
SISU
by LTD on Dec 2, 2009 9:00 AM EST up reply actions
Top shelf:
Or where some of the most exciting and skilled goals are made
Hurricanes Hockey:
Never for the faint of heart.
Nor for the weak of stomach.
Worth saying: a big thanks to Adam Proteau, James Mirtle and Greg Wyshynski. All were incredibly helpful in not only giving their opinions, but shaping the article.
yeah but you went the extra mile to include these folks and flesh out the piece. That could have easily have been just a soapbox piece but you went the extra mile by seeking out two valuable opinions ( Wysh is better than most give him credit for, Mckeon and Lambert OTOH can both suck an egg) and really made this a MUST READ article for anyone following the team.
Awesome article.
Thanks, Cory – I don’t post as much as I used to (unless I get pissed at someone like “Fehr” last night) but I had to let you know that this was much appreciated. This blog is my first stop everyday, and i monitor it all day. THANK YOU BOB – and HMo2 does a great job as well.
Good Stuff Cory! It’ll be interesting to see what happens from here…
greaticepectations.blogspot.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 2, 2009 12:19 PM EST reply actions
Most telling portion of the article . . .
Was the last paragraph.
“I think the best way he gives the Canes value is by the on-ice results, and the fact that a season like their current one can be met with such widespread disdain by their fans is a good indication of what people have come to expect from the franchise,” Proteau said. “Contrast that with the likes of the Panthers, Thrashers and Coyotes, and you see why that matters so much.”
Everyone here has probably had a conversation about how long this team would last in this market. The green seats in Greensboro, the empty buildings, all of it has contributed to the discussion. No one is having that discussion this year. No one.
I was working in the Crabtree Valley Mall store in 02-03 and 03-04 when the team was terrible. No one was talking about hockey. This team is worse than that, based on standings, and lots of people are talking about hockey here in NC and about the Canes in particular. The buzz is still here even if the team is not playing well.
Personally, I’m very happy about this. It means that JR can take the long term approach and do the re-build this team needs. I don’t know if it will be as quick as Philly’s or as long as St. Louis’, but it can now happen.
As for JR’s value, I’ll wait and see what he does in the next couple of seasons. The teams scouting has improved considerably in the last few years. If the team isn’t improved by the 2011-2012 season, then JR should probably be out. If the team is back in the playoffs by then JR gets to stay longer.
5 seconds left.
Do you believe in miracles?
YES!!
yes! I know at least one person read all the way through!
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 12:58 PM EST up reply actions
I know that’s a sarcastic statiment because you know everybody reads everything here. Hate to repeat the same comments, but it’s a great article and one that contributes to people returning to this site because you get more than mainstream and more than just safe news here. I remember your article about what if the ‘Canes had a bad season and the benefits from it. I think the house was divided about the subject and I wasn’t worried about it because it was the last thing I thought would happen, but here it is. And I agree with you C-L about the buzz still being here in a down year which goes to show how much the fan base has grown and evolved into a legitimate hockey town.
by hotchipsnsalsa on Dec 2, 2009 1:15 PM EST up reply actions
just a joke … Bob had told me before it ran that was good — and long.
I am long-winded (long-fingered?)
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 1:36 PM EST up reply actions
Listening to Peter on the NHL live and trying to figure why he got fired in the first place.
We were never this bad when he was coach right?
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
I just got done listening to that!! He did a dam good job at not throwing the team under the bus and just coming out and saying they suck. Took some effort I would think. While I agree with Capt. Stinky, Mo did bring up an interesting point or so.
1-no realistic chance at a PO showing
2-The injury’s are recent, they aive sucked from the get go, though.
3-time to shuffle some things around. Which dove tails into my philosophy and JR’s.
So the only question is, when is something gonna happen? LA just coughed up a pick for a player today. Would this be a good time to measure JR’s worth? I mean if he’s worth his weight in salt and has even a tenth of the clout he is credited with, he should be able to make something happen….
We shall see, I still think JR makes a move this week before Vancouver. In all likelyhood, we won’t be facing Luongo (I hope). They are facing a 4 game road trip and we are most assuredly the least of thier worries. BTW that dang Sedin is better thana point a game!! Anyway, I’d look for a small salary move and maybe a draft pick coming back.
A
The Canes are like a box of expired chocolates......
Shoulda read:
“While I agree with Capt. Stinky on Mo, Lavi did bring up an interesting point or so..”
The Canes are like a box of expired chocolates......
He even gave Raleigh some props for having awesome fans that would hang around in a season like this. I also thought it was funny when he talks about watching there games and knew the attendance numbers.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
Anaheim coughed up a pick for a player, not LA.
greaticepectations.blogspot.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 2, 2009 1:35 PM EST up reply actions
So you know, this is the equivalent of someone asking you “The Hurricanes are in South Carolina, right?”
greaticepectations.blogspot.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 2, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
Throw down the big bucks for center ice then you don’t have to worry about that.
A TRUE CANIAC......YES I AM........
Unless you get it though Direct TV.
Wonder what’s gonna happen, if anything, come PO time?
A
The Canes are like a box of expired chocolates......
in baseball, that’s true (L.A. Angels of Anaheim?)
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 1:43 PM EST up reply actions
Which is ridiculous because their names boils down to: Los Angeles (translated “The Angels”) Angels of Anaheim. So they’re The Angels Angels of Anaheim. Who was in charge of that?
greaticepectations.blogspot.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 2, 2009 1:51 PM EST up reply actions
This is true.
greaticepectations.blogspot.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 2, 2009 1:54 PM EST up reply actions
But also, Angels = Anaheim
Dodgers = LA
greaticepectations.blogspot.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 2, 2009 1:52 PM EST up reply actions
Well get arrested in Anaheim and you wind up in the OCJ on Flower St. and that’s LA!
err so I’ve heard, anyway..
A
The Canes are like a box of expired chocolates......
Well, there’s a Flower St. in both Anaheim and LA. And I think both have jails on them. Whatever.
greaticepectations.blogspot.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 2, 2009 2:18 PM EST up reply actions
So it goes with 70- to 80-hour work weeks during FB season for me.
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 3, 2009 8:49 AM EST up reply actions
Great article, Cory! It was great hearing Wysh and Mirtle’s takes on the situation.
I’m glad Rutherford is remembering the fans in all this. I don’t want him to spend a buttload of time trying to trade players right now, but I would like to see a few competitive hockey games this season. I hope he makes a few moves to make things interesting at least.
my beef with JR
There is no doubt that JR has done some very good things for this organization, but my concern with him is consistent players. Since becoming the Hurricanes (I didn’t follow them as the Whale) the history of this team is one of a yo-yo. I understand it’s hard to build a consistent winner year after year on a small market budget, but the same basic core group can be fighting for ( or winning ) the Cup one year and tanking it the next. He seems to be very reactionary in his decision making, and overly loyal to players that other GM’s would have passed on. Only this summer he realized that the game requires bigger and/or stronger players. This after signing players like Samsonov to multi-year deals. He’s come up with some great bargains, but he’s made too long a commitment to these bargains in order to sign them. He gave Samsonov a multi-year deal. He gave Wallin a no-trade clause. Most GM’s would not have given the “Secret Weapon” a no trade clause, and would not have feared losing Sammi if he wouldn’t take a one year deal. Now we have young players that could be developing up here in the AHL and the team is in last place. At this point most GM’s would start the rebuilding process, but JR has painted himself into a corner, where he can’t really do anything.
He’s up against the salary cap, and in last place in the NHL. His loyalty to some players has hurt the team’s chances. In the 10 years the Hurricanes have been in North Carolina he has repeated his same loyal behavior over and over. Now that a pretty large scale rebuild is inevitable, why wouldn’t anyone want a fresh face to put the new stamp on the club?
fwiw, it’s a one year problem and not a large scale rebuild. For the first time since the move to Raleigh, the team is prepared to replace old parts with new ones.
by Cory Lavalette on Dec 2, 2009 10:06 PM EST up reply actions
I won’t disagree with any of your basic points. But..
I think his over-loyalty does pay some dividends in creating an attractive work environment for players that might not otherwise tolerate playing in a relative hockey backwater. But yeah, he’s badly over done it this time.
And despite the incomprehensible win-lose-lose season cycles the ‘Canes are stuck in I still think he’s the best available guy to fix it. I trust him to fix it more than I would a new guy. There’s a lot of great hockey organizations that can’t touch the ‘Canes playoff runs. Dismiss them as luck or voodoo, it doesn’t matter. They’re facts, and other organizations can’t do it.
Carolina Hurricanes...2011 Stanley Cup Champions
Excellent work Cory. My non-Canes fan perspective has always been that he has been the best GM in the division and one of the tops in the league. GMGM is gaining on him, especially with some of his recent drafts, but I still think JR as of now is still a step above. He’s kept the Canes competitive in a smaller market, not an easy thing to do, even with the cap. Obviously, he’s not as good as Lou in Jersey, but then again who else is.
I’d think he’s have plenty of offers if he was ever canned. This year just seems to be one of those years where everything hits all at once. Injuries, older guys looking old, scorers in slumps, etc. Certainly your roster needs a bit of revamping, but I’d be very selective especially when it comes to younger guys. JR has acknowledged that they need to make some moves. I just think it will take longer than he or most of you would like. Other GM’s will smell blood and try to get guys on the cheap. JR will probably have to wait until closer to the deadline to get good deals. Injuries on other teams could move things faster though.
A man gotta have a code
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