Turn Your Back on Orpik at Your Own Risk
by Bob Wage on May 15, 2009 10:19 PM EDT
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PrintFrom time to time Cory and I will have a bit of a "clash" here on the blog. With all due respect to my friend and cohort, I disagree with his article about it being time to forgive Brooks Orpik.
First of all, to even mention the Scott Walker/Aaron Ward incident in the same breath as what happened between Erik Cole/Brooks Orpik, is an injustice. Cole's hit was totally unprovoked while Ward initiated much of what happened prior to Walker decking him. Was Walker right in what he did? No, and he will admit it, but that was as close to an altercation as you can have without actually being in one. All Cole was doing was chasing down a puck when he got nailed.
Most importantly, the extent of Ward's injuries were a black eye and a bruised ego. He'll be back to being the good ole' smart ass Aaron Ward he always has been. Erik Cole on the otherhand had his career and life altered. Before the hit, Cole had 30 goals and 29 assists in 60 games. He has yet to return to form, and will undoubtedly suffer the monetary consequences come contract time this summer.
Last but not least, Walker showed immediate remorse. He recognized what he had done and leaned down to check on Ward on the spot. That is what might have saved him from being suspended.
Orpik has never shown any public remorse. He reportedly attempted to contact Cole awhile after the incident, and was rebuffed. One has to wonder just how sincere the attempted apology was, considering the circumstances.
I do agree with Cory that the defenseman has not totally crossed the line, (although he has straddled it), since then. He's tough and mean, but usually pretty clean. (If not on the borderline).
But let's put all this aside for a moment and assume that Orpik is the nicest guy in the NHL. Pretend that he's up for the Lady Byng this year.
In my opinion, Caniacs still have every right to keep the "B.O. hate" for as long as they want to. Fans, (short for fanatics), can be irrational at times. They can be unreasonable. And Caniacs have hated players for much less than what Orpik did.
I remember some of my most enjoyable nights at the ESA, (now RBC), back at the turn of the century. (does that make me sound old?) The most important ticket that I always had to have was when the Flyers came to town. Why? So I could listen to and partake in booing Keith Primeau.
Perhaps I am a bit weird, but I loved the atmosphere at those games. Who can forget the "Primodonna" signs? Or when fans threw fake money at him when he entered the tunnel?
What exactly did Primeau do to earn Carolina's wrath? Well, he did not break anyone's neck.
After a long and contentious contract dispute, things got a bit nasty between the Primeau camp and Hurricanes management. The Canes leaked out some of the numbers which the former Hurricanes captain was rejecting, and fans started to sour. The final straw was when Primaeu's exasperated agent was quoted as saying that the star would not sign in Carolina for any amount of money. He may have also said a few negative words about the franchise as well as not wanting to play in this non-hockey market.
Many fans took this as a personal insult and carried the hatred for years, even though Carolina probably got the better of the eventual trade which sent Primeau to Flytown and Rod Brind'Amour to Raleigh.
My point in all of this? Fans are fans and it's fun to hate and boo villains, even if it's unwarranted. Caniacs always booed the (great) Scott Stevens. One Hurricanes fan even went to his Hall of Fame induction ceremony in Toronto just to heckle him. (perhaps a bit extreme?).
If you want to forgive and forget, that's cool. If you prefer to boo and carry your dislike for someone to the grave, that's cool too. As a fan, it is probably much more fun to carry the hate.
Do you think Boston fans will forgive Scott Walker next season?
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Nice counterpoint Bubba. I agree, It’s fun to have a villain onto whom we can channel our fanaticism. But I also dig what Cory’s getting at — that we can’t know how it affects these guys, and that Boston’s hated villain ended up (perhaps not coincidentally) being the victor in the end.
see how we ended up bringing it all full circle ; )
That would’ve been great planning if it was planned. lol
by Cory Lavalette on May 15, 2009 10:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I have a different explanation for that:
The hockey gods have a WICKED sense of humor. Not to mention irony.
Not the one game I got to go to. I may be wrong, but I think it was his first appearance at the ESA in a Flyers uniform. We won (don’t remember the score), every time he touched the puck everyone booed, and at one point Primeau was leveled at center ice to blow the top on the arena. One of my first games, it was great.
by Cardiac 'Canes on May 16, 2009 3:20 AM EDT up reply actions
I remember he made the comment about coming back to Carolina to play in front of “all 7,000 fans….” (or something to the same effect)….
Geez Bubba…. Now I really miss being able to hate Keith Primeau……
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 10:05 AM EDT up reply actions
Who says you have to stop? I never did.
by Iggy Reilly on May 16, 2009 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions
well…. he isn’t playing anymore…. and the last time I called him to tell him what a useless ass hat he really is… he hung up on me ;-)
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 12:08 PM EDT up reply actions
My Take
Every player is in control of themselves while on the ice. It is their job. Think of it like us going into work. We all have to make decisions on how to act. If any one of us chooses to do something that is against the rules, we suffer the consequences. If someone is seriously hurt from our decision, we may suffer the consequences of that action for years. Hockey players are no different. There are rules in place to protect others. When a player chooses to go outside the lines, they are agreeing to live with the consequences. What Orpik did to Erik Cole was way, way out of bounds. He has had to live with the consequences. In this case, from Canes fans, this is about a 10 year sentence. A sentence that includes ridicule, booing, sincere anger and disgust.
For Scott Walker, he plays on the edge. In this case he crossed over the line then quickly came back. For this infraction, he will likely get a much smaller sentence. A year or two of Boston booing, some trash talking some bad media.
The really sad thing in all of this is the innocent victim…… Erik Cole. Sometimes, bad things happen to good people. Erik too plays on the edge of the rules sometimes. Nothing EC has ever done would justify that hit. Orpik should be out of the league. He is dangerous and could really kill someone. Just ask Tiger Williams if that can happen. Sean Avery is in this category. He is a menace to Hockey society. He should not be allowed to play. These are the type of guys that cannot control themselves. The kind of guys that end up in jail. The type of people who choose to live outside the rules all of their lives. For that, there are consequences.
Claude Lemieux was like that. Would the league really miss these guys? I miss Erik Cole being able to fly down the right side showing the speed that got him here.
Amen brother
Orpik is a menace. He falls somewhere just short of a Todd Bertuzzi and the three game suspension was a freaking joke.
PS – Heads up. If you think the Bruins had the ref’s side in the last round what do you think Crosby will warrant from NHL refs? The NHL doesn’t want the Canes in the finals. They want Pens/Dead Wings.
No doubt...
There is no doubt the league does not want the Canes in the finals. Even if the refs are biased, there is one small problem with the “don’t let the Canes get to the finals” equation. The heart of a champion. The Canes have faced this bias all playoffs long. They clearly are not buying into that equation. The refs cannot look any more obvious than they are without being accused of a fraud. It just will make this run to the cup more special.
Orpik is a creep and Brind'Amour vs. Primodonna
Well said on Orpik. He is a very fortunate that him knocking Cole out in 2006 didn’t cost the Canes the Cup. It could have easily. Oprik might need a nice visit by Ru or LaRose in this round. Just a friendly hello – with a shoulder – just under the chin….
What was not well said was about the Primeau vs. Brind’Amour trade. Sorry – no contest there. Philly got a Glass Joe and someone who never really could be a true Captain. Brind’Amour? Well, just look at 2006. Who won a Cup? Who didn’t? Carolina isn’t a hockey market? Fine – whatever. I will take the Carolina playoff record during the Primeau/Brind’Amour era over the Flyer’s results any day.
Primeau was a brat. Orpik a thug. Call it like it is.
Great Post
Man are we fortunate to have such a great blog for the Canes! I wish that other teams that I follow had as good a blog as this. Props to Cory and Bubba.
I still harbor ill will towards Orpik, even more than Scott Stevens. Stevens, while mean and vicious, was a clean player. Orpik straddles the line constantly.
Then again, we have all been guilty of making mistakes in judgement. Its just that these men, like Scotty
Walker, have to endure the pressure of the media machine.
Go Canes!
by SouthernHockeyFan on May 16, 2009 9:51 AM EDT reply actions
I think many Canes fans have already let this one go. I know I have, and my position is well documented. In one of the 06/07 games, Cole fought Orpik, and I think that’s where it ended for me. I don’t think Erik Cole is walking around with this deep hatred for Orpik. I did for a while, but I let it go when it started to feel pointless.
I think it’s completely unfair to portray Brooks Orpik as some devious character, always running afoul of the rules, always cooking up some way to injure someone. As you correctly point out, Bubba, he’s an honest, clean, tough fuy. He’s only been suspended twice in his NHL career, and he doesn’t even have eyebrow raising PIMs.
I think it’s also off the mark as both Cory and Bubba have said that “Erik Cole has yet to return to form”. When you say something like that, you’re using the point-a-night numbers he had in 05/06 as your barometer. He was having a great season, but I think he was playing over his head.
The year after the injury, he came back with 61 (29/32) points in 71 games. That’s .859 ppg compared to the .983 in 05/06. Only a slight dropoff. The next season he had 51 points in 73 games (.699 ppg). Still better than any of his pre-lockout seasons. This season, his stats were exactly the same as they were in 03/04. His numbers might have been better had he been used properly in Edmonton. The point is that when you talk about a players (statistical) “form”, and returning to that form after an injury, you have to consider his entire oeuvre rather than one season. While Cole was putting up a point a night that season, his numbers before the lockout and those after the injury are in line with each other. I would say he has returned to form and that the 05-06 season was an anomaly.
And the same logic applies to the application of terms like “dirty player” vis-a-vis Orpik. Sure, he was guilty of a dirty play once in his career and of a kneeing incident one other time. That doesn’t make him a “dirty player”.
At the end of the day, everyone is entitled to their opinion even, and you’re entitled to cheer or boo when you buy your ticket. The funny thing is, though, players don’t really care when they get booed on the road.
by redblackhockey on May 16, 2009 10:06 AM EDT reply actions
So… you take a guy who improved on a consistent basis each year…. To the point where he is having his best season with (still) more room to improve…. and then… BREAK HIS NECK….. and his numbers drop off gradually each season after to the point where he has stats similar to his first two seasons in the league…..
And that isn’t a problem???
I think it is!!! And anyone who tries to sell you the line of “he was playing over his head” is crazy……
I see your point…. but with respect I do not agree….
Ever had a “stinger???” Erik Cole never had them before the Orpik hit….
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 10:13 AM EDT up reply actions
I completely agree...
…with the fact that Brooks is a hard nosed player, and that’s it.
With him at the top of the list in the hit statistics every year, sooner or later you are going to hit someone poorly. The fact that he has very little in penalty minutes and leads the league in hitting should tell you something. If you watch him on a regular basis, you’d know that he very rarely crosses the line.
As to the Cole incident, Orpik did try to apologize. And when that didn’t happen, he still felt bad. Brooks almost never fights, but in the first meeting with Cole after the injury, Brooks fought him. Why? I’m going to paraphrase slightly, but he essentially said ‘I owed him a chance to get back at me’. I don’t know, but somehow that all fits in with the hockey ‘code’.
And if you think he is always so out of line, when else is there that he did something horrible?
by The Merovingian on May 16, 2009 10:40 AM EDT up reply actions
And to clarify...
…I am a Pens fan first, and Canes fan second (I am moving to Raleigh very shortly). I can never root against the Pens, but I hate the fact that we’re playing each other. My only solace is in that I will get to watch one of my teams in the Finals! :-D
by The Merovingian on May 16, 2009 10:47 AM EDT up reply actions
Just promise me you’re not into NASCAR, and you don’t have any relatives named Jeb….
I’m kidding….
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 12:09 PM EDT up reply actions
Welcome to the area Merovingian. You will find the area a mixture of NC natives and outside transplants from all over the nation. It makes for a great cultural mix and a great place to live and raise a family. I also know that if I moved to Pittsburgh, NY, or Detroit I would wear my Canes jersey every time they came to town.
I dont agree with those here who think Orpik is a dirty player all around, but I do still hate him for that hit. I hate the NHL for a measly 3 game suspension, and I hate that Cole has not been able to play like he used to since.
I plan on booing everytime Brooks touches the puck, and cheering everytime a Cane so much as breathes the same air as him. I wish we played more like the Ducks… Brooks would have two black eyes, a broken nose, and probably a few stitches from a “wild” high stick.
by packpigskinfan25 on May 16, 2009 11:25 AM EDT up reply actions
I don’t wish we played more like the Ducks. I HATE the way they play. This is not a team I ‘love to hate’. I really do hate them. I think the league would be better off without them. I hate dirty plays and dirty players.
I’m not saying I think Orpik is a dirty player; I honestly don’t know. I also still hate him for that hit, not because I think he intended to hurt, but it wasn’t really an accident either. It makes me mad every time I see someone (ANYONE!) make a questionable hit. They all know better than that. If only the league would crack down on it…
Sigh.
by Andrea's evil twin on May 16, 2009 12:53 PM EDT up reply actions
I agree with you mostley. I hate the Ducks too… but I also hate how soft we can be. I guess that all changed with one Scott Walker punch though, didnt it?! hahaha
by packpigskinfan25 on May 16, 2009 3:14 PM EDT up reply actions
We’ll see if that punch translates into us not being seen as soft. But you can play tough without being a dirty bastard… (and no, I’m not saying I think walker’s play was dirty, just that there is a level of play between ‘soft’ and ‘dirty bastard’)
by Andrea's evil twin on May 16, 2009 6:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting points.
What I see with Erik Cole is a guy who has a stiff neck all the time now. The fact that he has a hard time turning his head slows him down on the ice. Of course he is still one of the smartest players in the league so he has compensated by changing his game to what he is able to do. His recovery time is not good either. He may need a couple of days to get over a high hit. This injury was no accident. It was a purposful act by a guy who lost control. I did not call him a dirty player. Just has the ability to loose self control in a way that could cause serious injury or worse. This personality trait is not rare. It is more common than people think. The jails are filled with guys who are nice most of the time. It only takes once to kill someone.
This has not only affected Erik’s career, it has affected his quality of life.
A little off topic….. but this story isn’t quite what the headline says…..
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 11:06 AM EDT reply actions
You may have to go back to page one to read the article from the start…. my bad….
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 11:07 AM EDT up reply actions
Great link (and great discussion)
I can’t comment on the Orpik controversy. If that isn’t an entirely male discussion, I don’t know what is. (i don’t mean that in a bad way,
it’s just a guy-to-guy honor and duty thing. I don’t pretend to get these rules in their full depth.)
Loved this piece from the Bleacher report – thanks for posting. I guess I kind of like the Cinderella story line myself. (I have a 4-yr old daughter to complement my hockey boys).
by Carolyn Christians on May 16, 2009 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Thanks for posting that…..
And the Staal Drinking game begins ;-)
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions
the official rules - in case you missed them the first time
by Carolyn Christians on May 16, 2009 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Like most drinking games, you will be comically drunk at the end of one period, dangerously so at the end of two, and probably asleep before the end of three.
by Iggy Reilly on May 16, 2009 12:17 PM EDT up reply actions
head over the toilet after three…
by Andrea's evil twin on May 16, 2009 12:37 PM EDT up reply actions
Earlier this season we made up a Tripp Tracy drinking game…. but have not posted the rules anywhere this season….
Basically you drink any time Tripp Tracy says something like: “Boy John… I’ll tell you…. If Cam ward would have been over just a second sooner he would have stopped the puck from going in…”
Or the Classic Tripp Tracy line: “I’ll tell you…. If (insert other team here) hadn’t scored that last goal to make it 3 to 2 we would still have a tie-game….” (that’s two drinks)
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 12:38 PM EDT up reply actions
I like to take a drink when he refers to texting ANYONE related to the team.
Tripp Tracy is such a goober, but he is our goober damnit.
Very true…. and it doesn’t seem right to see Forslund working a game w/ anyone else….
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Lots of stuff going on…. The Hurricanes web site is now reporting that Scott Walker will have media availability this afternoon to discuss a situation where apparently his wife has been diagnosed w/ Cancer (he is requesting privacy for his family, but he will meet w/ the media)…. www.carolinahurricanes.com
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 12:58 PM EDT reply actions
I think the outlook is more positive than it certainly could be…. But still… even when someone is expected to make a full recovery…. Any type of cancer is nothing to fool around with…. What a week for that guy….
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 1:16 PM EDT up reply actions
Suddenly everything is so much clearer, isn’t it? I wish them all the peace and strength and many more game winning goals. Wow.
by Carolyn Christians on May 16, 2009 1:14 PM EDT reply actions
Gee doesn't Boston look stupid now.
Life has a way of pointing out what is important every so often.
Alas..........even Melrose has abandoned the Canes.
http://espn.go.com/nhl/playoffs/2009/news/_/id/4170728/2009-stanley-cup-playoffs-experts-picks
And these guys are supposed to be the experts.
I thought Melrose was a Caniac for life…… I guess he has no more man-love for #36……
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 1:30 PM EDT up reply actions
And I love how the “Experts all picked Shitsburgh AND Detroit…..”
I mean…. they may wish that for their stupid TV ratings…. but they need to read up on how the “hurricanes are ruining the playoffs….”
by Mateos_Canes_Lamp on May 16, 2009 1:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Perfect!
These predictions seem to have worked out very well for the home team. I couldn’t be more delighted with this news.
by Carolyn Christians on May 16, 2009 1:40 PM EDT reply actions
I've let it go BUT....
I will have a short temper with orpik. Even if alot of folks have forgiven him, the moment he gives a questionable hit to anyone, that “I’ve let it go” mentality will be lost.
I need to explain to [remind?] my two Pens fan co-workers
why Orpik will get soundly and repeatedly booed at the RBC Center.
I’ve monitored Orpik’s career aftrer the hit and while he has some talent he chooses to play at the edge of what’s considered legal. So be it. But if some player suddenly ends BO’s career the NHL would be a better place. I’ll boo him forever if only to keep the crowd in it. The players definitely can hear it, and they know why.
As for Primeau, we missed the playoffs by one point the season he decided 4 million (or whatever) wasn’t enough to play here. Cost us playoff visibility, credibility, and revenue.
I even booed his brother. Our team, Our tradition indeed.
Hear! Hear! Buba, your right, and Cory is a moron. In fact Walker should beat OrPricks ass fist second of game one. Then again at 5:01 when they get out of the box. Ill be happy when OrPrick gets his neck broken and we can all laugh the way the Pittsburgh fans have over his hit on Cole.
Orpik is a dirty player, and Caniacs aren’t the only fans who think so. Every season gets suspended at least once for hits just like he put on Cole. He routinely crosses the line, and if the NHL allowed Goons back in the game, he’d get knocked out cold. But the NHL seems to not mind concussions ala Orpik or even Stevens, only premeditated fights, and so Orpik will continue to shorten careers of other players around him with his ‘questionable’ hits.
It kills me how none of these hits took place 15-20 years ago, and now the ‘keep your head up in the neutral zone’ is the defense to knocking someone out cold with a head shot.
Orpik hasn’t been suspended since the Cole hit.
by Cory Lavalette on May 17, 2009 1:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Orpik left his feet...
The photo in the N&O today shows the hit and you can see that not only did Orpik board Cole, he left his feet in doing so (which was something I didn’t realize before, I’d only seen video replays and not still images). That to me shows a blatant and despciable disregard for the other player’s health. What a goon.
Good thing we arent playing AO… cause he leaves his feet on EVERY hit.
by packpigskinfan25 on May 17, 2009 11:56 AM EDT up reply actions
perspective
I don’t think Orpik is a dirty player. He is in the top of the league every year in hits and has low PM’s so he certainly isn’t dishing out dirty shots very often. Its all about perspective and how things are shown. Take the nice picture and caption on this article. Go check out the video of this hit and you will see that AO was trying to check Orpik not Orpik hitting AO in the back as it suggests. In my perspective knowing the truth of that picture before reading the article makes it seem like the writer is just trying to get the fans going, gotta have a villian in every series I guess. Regardless of that the Orpik/Cole thing happened like a million years ago and both players have moved on with their careers and lives. I don’t think they will go after Orpik. Wrong time, wrong place. You take care of that stuff during the regular season. Oh, wait, didn’t that already happen when they wrestled and danced (can’t classify that as a fight) after Cole came back from his injury? Anyways just some perspective from a Pens fan. Take it or leave it. Here’s to a good/hard fought series between the 2 best teams in the East. May the best team (Pens) win!!!
Got to confess that I’ve joined the ranks of Orpik haters, as a result of the Caps-Pens series. I wonder how Orpik keeps his penalty minutes low.
During that series, he slashed Alex Semin in the face so that he needed stitches. Along with various instances of tripping and cross checking, the vast majority of those not called as penalties.
And then he had the nerve to call Ovi a dirty player after the hit on Gonchar. The problem I have with Orpik is that he does plenty of dirty hits of his own so he doesn’t have room to criticize others as dirty players. A guy who injured Erik Coles as seriously as he did does NOT have the right to call others dirty players. I saw an earlier post on this blog that referred to Orpik as a “goon with talent”.
“Got to confess that I’ve joined the ranks of Orpik haters, as a result of the Caps-Pens series. I wonder how Orpik keeps his penalty minutes low.
During that series, he slashed Alex Semin in the face so that he needed stitches"
Like that doesn’t happen on a constant basis around the league. Game 7 of that series Orpik got a stick to the mouth, bleeding on the ice and there was no call. I believe it was Steckel (SP) that did it. Is he a dirty player? You’re saying you don’t like him because he does what just about every player in the league will do as much as and as long as they can get away with it……slashing, hooking, crosschecking, tripping name me someone that doesn’t do this stuff when they think they can get away with it. I’m sure the stick to the face was an accident just as i’m sure Steckels stick to his face was an accident. Weren’t the Caps one of the most penalized teams in the league this year? Hey pot, meet kettle I guess.
what you people fail to realize
is that cole did exactly what the title of this article says; turned his back. not on brooks orpik, but on a hit. nhl players are smart. you know and i know that they will turn their backs to a hit, protect themselves with their arms, and make it look like boarding. these players know they will more than likely not get hurt by doing this. however, cole did get hurt. and seriously at that. and that really was unfortunate.as canes fans i understand your position on orpik, but as hockey fans, watch that hit again, tell me that cole didnt turn away from it, and tell me how you expect orpik to stop.
its hockey people. with the speed of this game and the way its played, people get hurt. i will be surprised in fact if someone doesn’t die on the ice in my lifetime. but you guys need to find a different reason to hate on the pens than a hit that was half the recipients fault.
BringBackRobBrown
While by no means do I condone the actions of Brooks Orpik (and I have to say the intent to injure can be highly debated as noted by the last post), the degree to which this has carried on is beyond ridiculous. Hockey has many unfortunate cheap shots, but the degree to which Cole took in this media this eclipsed cheap shot acts like Tie Domi’s hit on Neidermeyer or, more recently, Brashear’s hit to Betts. While it is unfortunate that he got hurt, I have to think that Cole’s personality is soft – not for getting hurt, but for he and his coaches at the time whining and complaining about it in the media for months on end.
by BringBackRobBrown on May 18, 2009 10:30 AM EDT reply actions
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