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Winning On The Cheap - It Can Be Done

The Carolina Hurricanes will have to get a lot out of young players like Drayson Bowman, Brandon Sutter, and Zach Boychuk if they want to be competitive next season.  (photo by LTD)

Earlier this week, there were reports out of 1400 Edwards Mill Road that Carolina Hurricanes owner Peter Karmanos wanted to cut his team's expenses from last year by about $15 million.  Last season, the team's payroll bumped against the salary cap ceiling at times and once they were even forced to put Cam Ward on the long term injured list so that they could free up cap space to make room for a recalled player.

That will not be a problem this coming season. 

Historically, the Canes have been more of a "budget team" than a "cap team", but this year things might be even tighter than usual.  With Karmanos attempting to sell a large portion of the franchise, it's likely that more emphasis will be placed upon the club to be a self sufficient entity, if not profitable. 

The team operated at a loss last season and there are two primary ways to fix that, increase revenue or cut costs.  The player's salaries are the biggest expense for any team, so that reduction is obviously targeted first.

After hearing that the team will be cutting payroll, the natural reaction for many fans is gloom and doom. They might be wondering how the team can compete or succeed without spending money for the top players? But having deep pockets does not guarantee deep runs in the playoffs.  Just ask fans of the Toronto Maple Leafs.

Star-divide

While several small market teams with tiny budgets fail to make the playoffs year after year, the same can be said for some large market teams who spend to the cap limit most seasons.  It would seem that proper scouting, drafting, coaching, and management would trump the effect of simply spending more money.  And the proof is in the results.

Pittsburgh did not buy their way to prominence, they drafted their way to the top.  Now they are paying to the Cap limit in order to keep their top players.  The same can be said about Washington and Chicago.  These teams did not simply rely on free agent acquisitions to make it to the playoffs, even though they spend a lot of money right now.

And every season there are examples of how teams have succeeded without spending close to the cap.  Buffalo, Nashville, and Phoenix all did it this year.   

The Canes have done it before and have even succeeded at the highest possible level without spending near the cap.  There is no reason they can not do it again. 

In the summer of 2005, Paul Kariya was one of the top free agents available on the market.  The Canes were in the running for his services but eventually were out-bid by Nashville.  Several in the local mainstream media blasted Carolina management for not stepping up to the plate to get Kariya.   

But instead, Jim Rutherford signed Ray Whitney, (1.5) and Cory Stillman, (1.75), two players who were not highly sought after at the time.  Earlier, they brought aboard Martin Gerber and Matt Cullen, two more players who were making less than $1 million each. 

Those four players were instrumental in helping Carolina to a franchise record regular season, as well as a Stanley Cup Championship.  Kariya had a great year but earned $4.5 million that season.  The Canes were able to sign four valuable players for less than that price. 

Even after the Hurricanes acquired high priced rentals, Doug Weight and Mark Recchi, they still were only ranked 16th in the NHL in spending that season with a payroll of $35 million. 

Can the Canes succeed again in the future, even if they don't spend to the Cap limit?  Of course they can.  But not only will the focus be on management to bring in the right players at the right price, the focus will also be on the coaching staff.  It will be more important than ever for Paul Maurice, Ron Francis, Tom Barrasso, and Tom Rowe to get the most they can out of their players and to develop them properly. 

The Hurricanes have an advantage right now because they can save money by utilizing several talented young players who have the possibility of being stars in the NHL.  Is Carolina another Chicago in the making?  We will find out in a couple of years.

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Coaching a Young Team

It will be more important than ever for Paul Maurice, Ron Francis, Tom Barrasso, and Tom Rowe to get the most they can out of their players and to develop them properly.

      Obviously, from my previous posts, I am a strong, strong advocate for the young players in the Hurricanes system. I see the Hurricanes as being the next Chicago; but so much depends on the ability the coaches to nurture the young talent. From what I have seen the young talent has tremendous potential; but the challenge will be in adjusting to the incredible grind of an 82 game season. It is the M/F/R/B’s coaching team’s chance to show they can take the young players and the proven veterans and mold a winning team. It’s a chance of a lifetime for the young players. It’s a chance of a lifetime for M/F/R/B because if they succeed they will have the making of a consistent top six team; and ultimately a chance to win the Stanley Cup.

   In times like these, there is a lot to be said for simple blind faith.

   

     Equally important is that the fans and ownership have to work together to get revenues up and therefore the salary budget increased to the point that the Hurricanes are not always behind the spending curve.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 3:13 PM EDT reply actions   1 recs

If staal is Toews and Ward is Niemi who is Kane? Who is Keith? Who is Bolland or Buff or the Barker, even if he’s been traded. The canes can do it but they are no where near it. If they want to do that its going to take some time and some high picks which require bad seasons.

I just wish JR would have given up Ray Whitney for Lent.

by C-Leaguer on Jun 4, 2010 5:06 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Haven’t you been listening, McBain’s gonna win the Norris next year, Tlusty, Osala, Dalpe are all going to be 30 goal scorers next year. We’re fine, because our GM is genius/DemiGod/Cerebral Giant we have the best prospects in the NHL.

by Go_Shelf on Jun 4, 2010 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

I said a prayer at my altar after my original post. I’m hoping jr is a kind demi-god. ;-)

I just wish JR would have given up Ray Whitney for Lent.

by C-Leaguer on Jun 4, 2010 6:45 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Tlusty, Osala, Dalpe

  Tlusty, Osala, and Dalpe will assuredly provide more to the team than Yelle, Brind’Amour, and even Samsonov – whether they all score 30 goals, 20 goals or 10 goals. They are all around faster, stronger, more motivated, and more willing to give and take a hit. McBain is vastly better than either A. Ward, Wallin, or Alberts; however, you might want to test out that theory but using two teams in a fantasy league and put A.Ward, Wallin, Alberts, Yelle, Brind’Amour, and Samsonov on one team, and McBain, Carson, Tlusty, Boychuk, Osala, and Dalpe on another.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 9:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

Comparisons

Pitkanen is a top defender like Keith;

Ruutu is a superior forward to Big Buff;

Kane is the harder issue and hopefully Connolly becomes the Hurricanes Kane. Anybody watching the Hurricanes has to realize that Staal and Jokinen would be well-served to play with a player having the speed and skills of Kane.

Bolland: seriously, check his stats. He is fine, but really 39 games, 6 goals, 10 assists, and 15 points? Bolland is in the realm of Chad LaRose and both are fine players.

   

http://blackhawks.nhl.com/club/player.htm?id=8471245

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Bolland is a difference maker. His stats do not reflect what he brings to the table.

Ruutu is very good but he doesn’t attack the net like buff.

Pitkanen is not Keith. He’s simply not. He is good, but only tomas kaberle good. He’s not Norris trophy good.

Again I’m not saying it can’t happen, but the team isn’t there yet and won’t be for a couple of years.

I just wish JR would have given up Ray Whitney for Lent.

by C-Leaguer on Jun 4, 2010 6:43 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Kane is a very nice player, but he really one-dimensional. He rarely skates, he more or less coasts, in the defensive zone and is often hanging out waiting for a breakaway. If the Canes select Connolly – I don’t think he’ll be as talented as Kane, but I hope he’s more of a complete player.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 9:45 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Weak comparisons

Sorry AD, weak post here. Keith is far better a D man than anyone the Canes have (or have had in many years). Who knows with Connolly, but Kane is an established star two games from a Stanley Cup right now. Byfuglien isn’t a failure, he was the reason Chicago defeated SJ. Bolland is the kind of character player that all Cup teams need, the kind that you seem to have a blindspot for given your very consistent opinions.

I like our young players, but only tremendous luck would make us a perennial power house team. We will be doing well if any one of Dalpe/Boychuk/Tlusty/Osala/Bowman become a legit top ten. I am hoping McBain stays great, but then again he may turn out to be a Babchuk type player, lots of PP goals, not much else. If by chance most of these guys turn out to be legit NHL stars, then we still need Rutherford to manage the cap successfully AND either MO to figure out how to coach this team, or a new coach who can get things done. We are a long way from being the Hawks.

by prplmnkydw on Jun 5, 2010 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions  

The Big Fail for Big Buff

  I am a great fan of Big Buff; but he has been a massive ship of failure thus far.

http://sports.espn.go.com/chicago/nhl/columns/story?id=5254244
Byfuglien becomes the Big Befuddlin’

  I think the the extreme pessimism over a team remaining essentially intact after it unloaded some of its worst players is inexplicable. I’m much happier with the Hurricanes keeping its powder dry this year so it can re-sign players like Jokinen and Pitkanen; and can give Sutter the raise he deserves.

  And by the way, Chicago does not seem to be a dynasty at the moment, so comparing the Hurricanes to Chicago is not comparison the Hurricanes to Detroit when they were men among boys as a dynasty franchise.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 8:57 AM EDT up reply actions  

Chris Pronger has won that battle so far.

Editing Manager of CanesCountry.com

by Bob Wage on Jun 5, 2010 12:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

Big Buff Vs. Pronger

  If one watched the Hawks throughout the season, there were plenty of games where he was a non-factor. I think he is an excellent player, but I don’t think he is superior to Ruutu. Big Buff had some great games in the playoffs, but he has been weak against the Flyers. Pronger is a jerk, but as long as the officials let him slash at will and interfere with other players without calling penalties, he is difficult to beat.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry, but when has Paul Maurice ever proved that he could develop young talent? If he has, please let me know because I can’t think of a time.

Also, to compare us to the next Chicago is interesting, to say it kindly. That’s a very tough comparison for the Rats/Checkers to live up to.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 4, 2010 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

Francis/Rowe/Barrasso/Daniels and Young Talent

I think Francis/Rowe/Barrasso/Daniels all have shown they can assess talent and can nurture it. The delegation of duties has been a good thing for the Hurricanes organization. In my view, if the Hurricanes do have a successful 2010 draft, they will have the quality and quantity of young talent pool see themselves as the next Chicago.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 7:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

I noticed you left out Mo, the head coach, the one who is suppose to have the biggest impact on all things relating to the hockey teams performance on the ice. Francis has been a coach less than 2 years; I don’t know if he has really proven anything yet regarding his coaching abilities.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 4, 2010 7:55 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Mo and Developing Young Talent

  I would like to see other examples where NHL head coaches were assigned the primary task of developing young talent. Absolutely, a jerk of a coach can suck the life and enthusiasm out of young players in any sport, including hockey. Even so, I don’t see Maurice as that kind of coach now; and particularly with Francis, Rowe, Barrasso, and Daniels having so much to do and say about their development.

  Francis has shown in his time at Carolina even in the front office that he has a tremendous eye for talent and that he has the ability to motivate and encourage the young players.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 9:01 AM EDT up reply actions  

Stevens in Philly did a pretty good job on developing young talent before being replaced by Lavi. Oh yeah, he’s available to coach.

And again the argument comes down to Mo developing young players. When has he done it? And while the other coaches wil have a hand in development, it is ultimately Mo’s job as the head coach. I just don’t think he’s the right man for a rebuild.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 9:37 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Francis

Look, I really love Francis, but what exactly has he done in his time as a coach? I mean granted, it has only been a few months, but let’s not pretend he has made some sort of major impact. Maybe he has been influential on Sutter? Obviously he was on Staal, but that was as Staal’s captain, not his coach.

by prplmnkydw on Jun 5, 2010 11:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

Francis

   I simply disagree with you. In the time Francis has been involved with both coaching and assessing young talent, the Hurricanes drafted Sutter, Boychuk, Dalpe, Bowman, Terry, Carson, and McBain. They traded for Tlusty and Osala as well.

   What factual basis do you have for saying Francis has had no major impact?

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Similarly, what factual basis do you have that Francis had anything at all to do with any of those draft selections? He’s a coach, not a scout.

Really, you’re the one making unsubstantiated claims here. The rest of us are in wait-and-see mode. Insufficient data, to date.

by Elsker on Jun 5, 2010 2:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ron Francis

Here’s a quick link for some of the factual basis:

http://hurricanes.nhl.com/club/page.htm?id=45234

“Following a career in which he established himself as the greatest player in Hurricanes franchise history, Ron Francis re-joined the Carolina Hurricanes organization in November 2006 as the team’s director of player development. He was promoted to Assistant General Manager on Oct. 4, 2007, but returned to the team’s locker room on Dec. 3, 2008, when he joined new head coach Paul Maurice behind the bench as Assosicate Head Coach. Along with his coaching role, Francis still maintains a voice in the Hurricanes’ front office decision-making, serving as the team’s Director of Player Personnel.”

   Now back to the question I asked, what factual basis do you have or does prplmnkydw have to support the contention that Ron Francis has proven nothing?

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

LOL! Honestly, AD, you’ve swallowed the proverbial hook, line, and sinker.

A blurb from the team’s PR department proves nothing.

So, no worries, eh? Good for you.

But, you know what they say: “If you can keep your head when all about you others are losing theirs…maybe you just don’t understand the situation.” :-D

by Elsker on Jun 5, 2010 3:56 PM EDT up reply actions  

  If there is any support for the contention that Ron Francis is not working with the scouts and the front office, I would welcome you providing the information to me.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 3:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

That was not the question.

You have established he has a job title.

The statement that he hasn’t yet proved himself as a coach has not been refuted.

by Elsker on Jun 5, 2010 4:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

Actually, your comment was unsubstantiated:

bq.Similarly, what factual basis do you have that Francis had anything at all to do with any of those draft selections? He’s a coach, not a scout.

The reality is that Francis is both a coach and works with the front office, including the scouts. The contention that Francis has done nothing is really a position that lacks any support in logic. Ron Francis has been involved in player personnel decisions and the players brought in during his tenure have been highly talented. On the other hand, if there is any public statement that exists to the contrary, I certainly an open to having my opinion changed. As it is, my conclusion is that Ron Francis has an excellent eye for talent and that Hurricanes have managed to amass some very significant young talent in a short amount of time.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 4:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

We all are fully aware of your opinions… but they are simply leaps of faith opinions, not facts.

Francis still has plenty to prove…to the rest of us, anyway.

by Elsker on Jun 5, 2010 4:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Another Ron Francis Link:

I think the Hurricanes have been extremely clear and open about the fact that Ron Francis’s strengths include his ability to recognize talent in players.

Carolina Hurricanes Sign Whalers Defenseman Brett Bellemore

“Brett is a big and smart defenseman who can log a lot of minutes,” said Ron Francis, Carolina Assistant General Manager and Director of Player Development. “He played well in Albany at the end of the year and we look forward to watching his development as a professional.”

rumors and opinions about the Plymouth Whalers hockey team.
Carolina Hurricanes Sign Whalers Defenseman Brett Bellemore
By Pete Krupsky
May 15, 2008, 2:55PM

http://blog.mlive.com/whaletales/2008/05/carolina_hurricanes_sign_whale.html

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 3:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

2006 Ron Francis Named Director of Player Development

November 27, 2006

http://www.sportsbusinessjournal.com/article/53046

Hockey
The Carolina Hurricanes named former NHL player Ron Francis director of player development.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 3:52 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ron Francis and Draft Choices

http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09203/985524-61.stm

Hall of Famer Ron Francis keeping his options open
Wednesday, July 22, 2009
By Chip Alexander, The News & Observer

Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09203/985524-61.stm#ixzz0q0hvbp1w

A half-hour later, off the ice, Francis was discussing defenseman Brian Dumoulin, the Canes’ second-round pick in the NHL draft last month.

“He’s a big kid, and a lot of times you see those kind of guys have trouble skating, but I thought he did a good job with his skating aspects,” Francis said. “As he gets stronger and fills out more, I think he’s going to be a real solid player for us.”

Sounds more like a player personnel director, doesn’t it?

Which, of course, should be no surprise. Francis now serves as the Hurricanes’ associate head coach and director of player personnel, a dual responsibility that gives him the opportunity to keep both future career paths open within the organization.

“I’ve been able to get experience in a lot of different facets of the game,” Francis said, "From player development to working with our scouts and understanding how tough the job is, to bringing these kids along, to understanding what coaches go through and their conversations in the locker room as well the responsibilities on the management side and how to make the players fit and keep the budget in line and keep the fans happy. There’s a lot of different parts that go into it.

Read more: http://www.post-gazette.com/pg/09203/985524-61.stm#ixzz0q0iAbdyz

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 3:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

More Data on Ron Francis' Role with Player Personnel

http://www.rbccenter.com/resources/pdfs/09-10_Staff.pdf

   

Following a career in which he established himself as the greatest player in Hurricanes franchise history, Ron Francis re-joined the Carolina Hurricanes
organization in November 2006 as the team’s director of player development. He was promoted to Assistant General Manager on Oct. 4, 2007, but returned to the
team’s locker room on Dec. 3, 2008, when he joined new head coach Paul Maurice behind the bench as Associate Head Coach. Along with his coaching role, Francis still
maintains a voice in the Hurricanes’ front office decision-making, serving as the team’s Director of Player Personnel.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 4:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

Just reading up here, but Adoug, I get the jist no ones really challenging the fact that Francis has been involved with drafting and player development in his short tenure. Were saying that Boychuk, Bowman, Osala, Dalpe, Murphy, Terry, Bellemore, Tlusty, Borer, Dimoulin and any others I may have forgotten havent proven anything at the NHL level. Sutters been a nice suprise, Brett Carson has been steady, and assumingly he’ll get better with age, and McBain has to prove himself over the course of a season. The rest are unknowns. No ahl or ncaa, or echl scouting report means anything until it produces and wins on nhl ice. Francis has done good in his short time, but he has much to prove on the ice.

by TylerA7707 on Jun 5, 2010 10:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Ron Francis

  Nobody can possibly argue the logic that Boychuk, Bowman, Dalpe, Osala, Murphy, Terry, Bellemore, Tlusty, Borer, Carson, and McBain have not yet proven themselves as NHL stars. The question to me is whether or not they are talented hockey players with tremendous upside. When Carson, McBain, Boychuk, Tlusty, Bowman, and Samson were brought up from Albany, they all played very solidly. The team as a whole played better with them than without them. Their next step is to keep up that performance level and improve upon it like Sutter has done.

  My point is simple: what more could one possibly ask of Francis in the time he has been working with player development? Have the Hurricanes ever had so much talent in their system?

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 11:22 PM EDT up reply actions  

AD, my point is; Ronnie is a great person to have in the organization, but I’m not sure of his coaching abilities. He could turn into a very good coach, but the jury is still out of that. I also have a feeling that he really doesn’t want to be a coach; he would rather be a front office person. My main concern is Paul Maurice as the head of developing these players. It is somewhat obvious that based on his history, he prefers older players. He did try to incorporate the younger players this season (especially at the end, when the Canes conceded the playoffs). I am not one that likes Month’s style of play and I really don’t want him teaching it to these players at a critical junction in their careers. I also don’t believe that all of these kids will develop as you do. Some will turn into solid pros, maybe 1 will turn into a semi-star, but some will never live up to their potential. But whatever happens, it will take a little time. These kids were not top 10 picks, meaning they most likely don’t have the ability to become solid NHLers out of the gate. That is why IMO the best course of action would be to bring in a young, NHL experienced player to fill a top 6 wing or 3rd line center position (like a Sharp, Krejci, Horton, or Hemsky) to help transition from the “old guard” to “new guard.”. I also believe bringing in one of those players would provide a little hope to some fans (like myself) that we will be challenging for a playoff spot this upcoming season, not JUST rebuilding.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 11:47 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

Ok AD, now back to my statement. Has Francis really proven anything in less than 2 years of being a coach? Supposedly one of his chief responsiblities is the Power Play. Has the PP over the past year and a half shown you anything? Just from memory; I believe you have made comments regarding a weak PP where players seem to out of position and unwilling to drive the net. Is that just because the players don’t want to do those things and say “F it, what the coach going to do anyway” or is it that he is not exactly a very good coach yet? Many great players have had trouble transitioning into coaching because they can’t understand why a player can’t/doesn’t do something. They did it with ease because they were great and they have trouble relating to players not of the same caliber.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 6:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

I’m not trying to say that Francis is a bad coach, but he hasn’t really proven himself YET to be a good one either. Mo and Ronnie are the “two” head coaches and to say either has proven to be a good developer of young talent is at best a reach. If we are looking to go young, bring in someone that has a good track record with player development. Maybe bring in a good AHL coach that knows how to work with the young people. I’m not as much against Ronnie helping develop our future as I am against Mo. If this is the direction we are going, Mo should not be steering the ship.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 6:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Hurricanes Power Play

   The flaws with the Hurricanes power play had much more to do with personnel issues than coaching per se. There is absolutely no question in my mind that if the Hurricanes had performed in the top 15 for the year in the power play, they would have made the playoffs. Once McBain came up to Carolina and once Sutter started getting more time on the power play, it improved significantly. The injuries to Staal, Cole (hurt in the second game), and Ruutu really hurt the power play. Take a look at the power plays during the 3/11/2010 game at the RBC against the Penguins, which the Hurricanes won 4 to 3. It really tells the tale of why the Hurricanes power play was too often ineffective.

   If you watch it online at www.nhl.com that version is with the Penguins’ announcers and they pull no punches about the Hurricanes power play. There is a sequence in particular that one really has to watch. It is a 5 on 3 power play for the Hurricanes. Brind’Amour (for reasons that seem sublime to me) was on the power play. There is no net traffic. There is no movement with anybody being able to cause the defense to move. The passes are stare down passes that might as well announce to whom they intend to pass the puck; and Brind’Amour is lost much of the time and is certainly unwilling to throw his body around.

   Once McBain came in and once Sutter was there attacking the net and working with Jokinen and Staal, the power play over the course of 2009-2010 improved. It still has a significant way to go; and until they get a Jordan Staal or Ryan Malone kind of player to create havoc in front of the net, it is going to be difficult. As for me, the addition of Babchuk will make a huge positive difference. Giving Boychuk and Tlusty time on the power play will help.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 6:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

The PP did have good moments at time, but was extremely inconsistent. The players definitely have their role in the inconsistent PP, but I also believe the style (coaching) plays its part. This is obviously my opinion as your comments are opinion also. I think if the PP style fit our personnel rather than trying to fit the players into a style, we would see more success. That is my definition of a good coach; fitting the style of play to the players, not trying to fit players into a system that doesn’t work with their strengths.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 6:53 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Hurricanes Power Play

  If you were Ron Francis, what would you have the Hurricanes do differently on the power play?

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 7:21 PM EDT up reply actions  

It would depend on what time of the year we are talking about, due to which players were available. If we are looking at the current projected roster, I would have two different style of play for the 1st PP unit and 2nd PP unit. I think this would keep the opponents a little back on their heels.

 I would employ an umbrella style for the 1st unit. Having Ruutu & Staal play in front of the net, Jussi on the right side, Joni on the left side, and McBain at the top center position. Staal & Ruutu would create more havoc than just 1 person in front of the net and they could also cause deflections and knock in rebounds. McBain’s big shot could be used from the top. Joni and Jussi could make cross ice passes and one timers.

The 2nd PP unit would be more conventional with Cole in front of the net, Sutter on the right side, Whitney on the left, Babs on the right point, and Gleason on the left point. We would pass the puck around for open shots, preferable from the points and have the wings drive the net when shots are taken to create havoc for the goaltender.

The different styles should create match-up problems and IMO would fit the players strengths. You could potential put Ray in Joni’s spot on the 1st unit, have Joni in Gleason’s spot on the 2nd unit, and insert Boychuk in Ray’s spot on the 2nd unit.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 8:13 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

  I agree that McBain and Babchuk bring a different dimension to the power play. What would you have done differently with the personnel available to Francis during the season? Cole was injured in the second game, for example. McBain did not play until much later in the season. Ruutu was out with his shoulder issue.
  
  I totally agree about havoc in front of the net. I don’t see Staal as being the best person for that job. Ruutu is awesome in front of the net; Jokinen is brilliant in his positioning. The problem I saw was more personnel during much of this year; and particularly with Samsonov and Brind’Amour getting far too much power play time in my view.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Again, at what point did you want me to analysis? Who are the players available to me? I would have to adjust the personnel and probably the style; to best fit those players strengths.

I actually think Staal is pretty good around the net and with two people down low, Staal could also take the puck behind the net and have options. He could try his infamous wrap, try to force one to Ru, or pass to a driving Jussi or Whitney for a one-timer.

And if Sammy and Rod were receiving too much PP time; who duty is that? That’s the coaching staff choosing who is on the ice for PPs.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 11:57 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Forwards Available in the Hypothetical

  Assume Ron Francis comes to you and says how should we play with these 12 forwards at your disposal:

(1) Staal, (2) Whitney, (3) Jokinen, (4) Cole, (5) Sutter, (6) Boychuk, (7) Dwyer, (8) Brind’Amour, (9) LaRose, (10) Samsonov, (11) Kostopoulos, (12) Ruutu

And the Defensemen available to you are (1) Gleason, (2) Carson, (3) Pitkanen, (4) Wallin, (5) A Ward, (6) Alberts

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 1:19 AM EDT up reply actions  

MoFroRoRasso?

http://www.prosportsblogging.com

by Great Ice-Pectations on Jun 4, 2010 3:20 PM EDT reply actions  

Or maybe MoFroRoSo?

by Chuck Burns on Jun 4, 2010 3:22 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Yeah, that’s better. Less tongue twisty.

http://www.prosportsblogging.com

by Great Ice-Pectations on Jun 4, 2010 3:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

MFRs is easier to type.

It's gonna be a long summer.

by Carolyn Christians on Jun 4, 2010 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

But then it looks like M.F.ers. Similar, but different.

http://www.prosportsblogging.com

by Great Ice-Pectations on Jun 4, 2010 4:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

There are times when that may be a cathartic experience.

It's gonna be a long summer.

by Carolyn Christians on Jun 4, 2010 4:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

sounds like someone warming up to sing :)

"The increase in pain is way beyond what you would expect a person to play with," said coach Paul Maurice. "Unfortunately it’s even beyond what Tim Gleason can play with, because he can play with just about anything."

by Cyn4Canes on Jun 7, 2010 10:42 PM EDT up reply actions  

Springing the trap

Full out Mo trap hockey is what I fear.

How else to keep the waves off Cam with less than a credible NHL defense?

Hope he doesn’t kill the joy of playing for these kids, like he did for Cole.

by Elsker on Jun 4, 2010 3:24 PM EDT reply actions  

Keeping Hockey Fun for the Kids, the Veterans, and the Fans

   I agree that it is critical that playing hockey be fun for the kids, the veterans, and the fans. All the x’s and o’s in the universe pale in comparison to having a team playing inspired hockey and loving their time on the ice. I’ve seen basketball players coached to death, and become shadows of themselves in the process. One main reason I was so happy Laviolette was fired was after 2007-2007, 2007-2008, it seemed the team had all the joy and radiance of playing sucked out of them. I am optimistic that with M/F/R/B as a coaching team, they will keep the kids and the veterans having fun while playing their hearts out.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 3:36 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lavi

because they were losing they had the joy sucked out of them, when everyone in the locker room knows the coach is at odds with management and the coaches days are numbered it’s no fun. I wouldn’t attribute the joyless play to Lavi or his system, if anything Lavi’s is funner to play because it’s a lot more wide open. Having said that, I prefer Mo’s hybrid trap system, it’s not as fun to watch, but we don’t get killed on odd man rushes either.

by Go_Shelf on Jun 4, 2010 3:48 PM EDT up reply actions  

I Hated Lavi's Lack of Structure

   For me, Lavi’s system was purely stupid – sorry to be so blunt. It reminded me of a football coach I had whose system made cornerbacks cover both the wide receiver and the quarterback – great work if you can get it. When I pointed out, I was happy to do one or the other, he told me to man up. Lavi’s way was to complain about odd-man rushes against them, but to send people into no-man’s land where they couldn’t stop the odd-man rush.

   I find this hybrid system a blast to watch because it has so many reads involved; but I don’t like it when there are ballet dancers sent out to search and destroy – meaning asking finesse players to become Ruutu and they resist and pretend they have gotten lost on the way to net.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 3:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

Both systems pinch the D. Lavi’s light was just much greener.

Odd man rushes are usually due to F3 forward failing to recognize they are the F3 and need to drop back to the blueline to cover.

Remember Lavi asking in training camp after a rush down ice “OK, who was the F2 on that rush?”…and both Staal and Williams raised their hands. :-D

by Elsker on Jun 4, 2010 4:06 PM EDT up reply actions  

But doesn’t it also require the Defensemen to recognize where F2 and F3 are and not to pinch in when one can’t get back to cover?

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 4:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

yes, but I think the comment had more to do with F3 not staying high and both forwards collapsing thus causing an odd man rush when the puck transitions.

by Go_Shelf on Jun 4, 2010 4:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

Forwards Transitioning and the Benefits of Speed

  It’s the ability of the forwards to read the play and transition that makes or breaks any system and particularly the M/F/R/B system. It is why speed is so important for the forwards. Look at the 3/18/2010 home game versus Washington (the one where AO was out (and Sutter was out for the game). On a number of different occasions Boychuk and Dwyer each came screaming back full speed to prevent an odd man rush when a Canes defenseman had pinched it.

  In the same game, Brind’Amour was on the power play for a 5 on 3, and he couldn’t get back due to being slow. The point being that extremely fast forwards can make up ground quickly enough to keep structure in the game.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 6:09 PM EDT up reply actions  

We’ll put you on the list of those who have tried to explain that approach to Joni. :-D

Actually, from a practical standpoint, the forwards have to react to the D deciding to jump into the play by falling back to cover the pinch.

by Elsker on Jun 4, 2010 5:04 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t get the football comparison’s, remember I grew up playing hockey. Lavi’s a hell of coach who may end up winning another Stanley Cup in a week or so, so calling his system stupid may not be appropriate. However I get your distaste for it. I don’t get your last comment.

by Go_Shelf on Jun 4, 2010 4:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

The M/F/R/B system is essentially one in which forwards’ major task is to put a body on their man during the forecheck and to separate the puck from the body. It rewards really fast and aggressive players while making it hard for players with less physical strength and less aggressive tendencies to do well. It is also extremely hard on players who lack both speed and acceleration to do well. The forwards in particular have to cover a tremendous amount of ice and have to love hitting to do well.

   When they put Samsonov and Brind’Amour together on a line, things fall apart because neither one lives for the joy of laying a devastating hit on somebody; and neither have speed. Brind’Amour lacks both speed and quickness. It was awful when Yelle and Brind’Amour were playing together on a line for the same reason. Yelle didn’t mind physical play but he often forgot how to do so without taking penalties.

    Cullen had some trouble with the system because he is not somebody who was passionate about making massive hits. He was tremendously fast and quick and had a great hockey brain; but the physical aspect and particularly behind the net was not his big thing. When the Hurricanes were trying to put together lines and had their more artistic players together, and particularly the less fast players, I found it difficult to watch. One can watch a hockey player and tell if he is holding back and finding some safe haven out of the dark, dirty areas or whether he is on fire to get to the net. Sutter, Boychuk, Bowman, Ruutu, Kostopoulos, and Dwyer have zero fear of the nasty ice. LaRose has zero fear of that area as well. They want to score and they want the puck on their stick. Samsonov and to some degree Brind’Amour need a GPS to find that area. They go there as if they are playing on a pond and the ice may break at any time. They tip toe through the tulips to get there.

   In the early part of this season, Maurice and Francis kept saying, we need more net traffic, we need to get to the dirty areas, we need to be creating havov in front of the net; and once Sutter and the kids came, I can only recall one instance in which there was discussion about a lack of battle in the physical danger zones.

   In a wide open system, there are so many rushes that space is available for the more artistic players to work their magic. The M/F/R/B system tends to require really fast players to have breakaways – so Staal, Sutter, Cole, Boychuk, and LaRose tended to be the ones on breakaways as a general rule.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Remember our current system is speed indifferent because we don’t have to press as much as compared to Lavi’s system. Speed kills no doubt, it stands to reason that with younger legs we’ll be faster, but our system doesn’t require it. Our system requires patience and understanding of when to press and when to sit back. Because we have so many young players we’ll probably hear a lot about playing simple, making high percentage plays, and not taking unnecessary risks. I cringe a little because young guys make young mistakes and we could be seeing a lot of them next year.

by Go_Shelf on Jun 4, 2010 4:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

  I agree that young players make young players’ mistakes; but I really have a strongly different opinion about the need for tremendous speed in the M/F/R/B system. Both offensively and defensively players who skate well and very fast are much, much better suited for the Canes system. They cover more ice on the forecheck and get to the pucks more quickly and on the backcheck they fill the passing lanes. As stated above, check out the Hurricanes 3/18/2010 game against Washington. I don’t want to discount the important of Jokinen’s and Whitney’s incredible hockey brains because reads are truly essential in this system; but the speed of Boychuk, Dwyer, Sutter, Staal, and Cole are really essential as well.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 6:13 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Hitting in MO's system

Sorry, I dont think this is an accurate read of MO style hockey. Find me the last highlight real quality hit by a Hurricane player…

by prplmnkydw on Jun 5, 2010 12:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

correction

Jeez…. highlight REEL quality hit.

by prplmnkydw on Jun 5, 2010 1:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

Lavi and Lack of Structure

Tonight’s game against Chicago illustrated what I hated about Laviolette’s system. Once the other team takes hold of momentum, there is no basic form to the game that let’s Lavi’s team settle down. They continue to run and run and run – despite giving up bad goals; and then lose 5 to 3 of 6 to 4 or 7 to 4 or something. It’s exciting as long as you don’t care about winning.

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 11:44 PM EDT up reply actions  

Just Curious...Do you work for the Hurricanes?

You sure seem to have a rosey pro-management view almost every other poster has at least a guarded view of the re-hire of Mo…yet you seem convinced he is a great coach while also taking shots at Lavi even while he is coaching another team in the Cup Finals. just seems strange unless….are you related to Mo?

by Caniac324 on Jun 7, 2010 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Nope, I have Zero Connection with the Hurricanes

   I don’t have any connection with the Hurricanes other than being a STH and being a fan. I also was stunned that Maurice was re-hired. He was not on my top twenty coaching prospects when Laviolette was fired.

  I have had the chance to speak with Maurice and to hear him speak on several occasions. I was impressed with how down to earth he is, how much he loved the details and nuances of hockey, and what a great sense of humor he had. I don’t know whether or not he will succeed at Carolina as a coach; but even if he does not succeed as a coach, I personally think he will stay within the organization.

  I do respect and like Jim Rutherford. I find him refreshingly direct. He is also a gentleman in terms of the way he deals with people. If I seem pro-management it is because they are making decisions that largely fall within the way I would envision myself dealing with the same issues. Some of the issues are far more complex and have far more moving parts than I can discern as a fan. At this point, I am concerned about the degree to which it seems the salary budget is being cut; but Jim Rutherford and Peter Karmanos always seem to pull rabbits out of the hat.

by abramsdoug on Jun 7, 2010 4:13 PM EDT up reply actions  

Laviolette

Yeah, he sure sucks. He doesnt have any idea what he is doing, and players hate playing for him. What did that bum ever do for us? What has he done since JR wisely showed him the door? I mean just compare his record to MO and our merry band of assistants. Lavi who?

by prplmnkydw on Jun 5, 2010 11:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

Lavi v. Maurice

  From my recollection having been at the RBC in 2006-2007, Lavi was the coach as the Hurricanes played non-hockey for the season and missed the playoffs. I also watched in 2007-2008 as Lavi continued to play veterans who were not producing and Hurricanes missed the playoff again. I watched in 2008 as the Hurricanes again started off slow and were not going to make the playoffs. Lavi was replaced by Maurice and the same team responded by going to the Eastern Conference Finals. Injuries to Ruutu and Cole in that series hurt the Hurricanes badly. Anybody who loves Lavi is entitled to his or her opinion; but the Flyers can have all the Lavi they want for as long as they want. He was awful at Carolina; and I will be interested to see how long it is before the Flyers fans conclude he is awful.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 1:46 PM EDT up reply actions  

Sometime after their post-Cup hangover wears off, perhaps.

We’ll see if they have the same lazy complacent bunch we had the next season…or two.

by Elsker on Jun 5, 2010 2:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

Awful?

Abramsdoug, I do enjoy reading your posts and the passion in each of them for the game of hockey is obvious. However, I really don’t think you can call Lavi “awful” when he won us a Cup and he’s at the big dance now. I don’t believe Mo has done either of those even though he is the “winningest coach in franchise history.”

by JCLowe on Jun 6, 2010 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

He's also the losing-est coach in franchise history

Are his wins greater than loses in reg+loses in OT? NOT.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paul_Maurice

All things being equal, I’d rather have Laviolette back.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Peter_Laviolette

Go Canes!

by ivyleager on Jun 6, 2010 8:08 PM EDT up reply actions  

+1,000,0000

most sane fans would to me Mo vs Lavi is a no brainer…..Lavi is so obviously the winner in that one….like asking would you rather have a $1 or $1000 ? take your time now

by Caniac324 on Jun 7, 2010 2:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

Awful?

   Maybe the subjects of Laviolette and Brind’Amour are ones over which I lack sufficient objectivity. I thought Laviolette did a great job in 2005-2006; but I also thought the team played horribly under him after that. I came to dislike intensely what I thought was a completely disorganized approach to hockey. It struck me as YMCA basketball for strategy or something akin to “hey guys, let’s all meet at the crease.”

  I had never seen any hockey team play with less heart and desire than the Canes in 2006-2007. Like many fans I assumed it was the Stanley Cup hangover. I started to hear discussions from different fans that Laviolette had lost the locker room and that he was playing favorites. In 2007-2008, it was much the same thing until the young Rats came to the team and suddenly the team had a chance at the playoffs. The last five games of that season discouraged me and made we want a change of coaches. The start of 2008-2009 was terrible; and I was one of those fans calling for Jim Rutherford to fire Laviolette; and I was very excited to hear in December, 2008, that Laviolette was in fact fired.

   I readily acknowledge I had been looking at other possible coaches and Maurice was not one of them I had considered might be selected. I didn’t like his style of hockey during his first tenure and I was concerned the team would simply be painfully boring to watch. I have no idea whether Maurice has changed, the talent pool has changed, Jim Rutherford and Ron Francis convinced him to change, but I like the way the Hurricanes played under him in the 2008-2009 season; and I liked how they played starting at the end of December, 2009.

   I had an extreme dislike of Laviolette’s approach because I think it is a style that guarantees one tremendous success per team – a Stanley Cup and then years of mediocrity. To me game 5 of the Chicago game was a perfect example. Once Chicago game out like apes out of a cage (meaning nothing pejorative), under Maurice one could expect the plan at least to be slow things down and work to get the momentum of the game under control; under Laviolette, the Flyers took more and more chances and lost structure more and more. By the team the Flyers started their push, the hole was too deep. Laviolette’s system strikes me as high risk and high reward, but little chance of consistency year after year.

   I personally think Laviolette is very well-suited to take a team one time to the Stanley Cup; and he may do so for the Flyers. The aftermath, I think, is very painful for the organization because after the conquest of the Stanley Cup, the team will falter and one will spend two or three years trying to put back the pieces with another coach. That at least is how I see it.

by abramsdoug on Jun 7, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think what most changed things for Cole was the broken neck he suffered in 2006.

by Chuck Burns on Jun 4, 2010 3:35 PM EDT via mobile reply actions   1 recs

Way before then, he had spoken about almost giving up the game.

You could see it in his shoulders and whole demeanor in ‘03-’04, in particular.

Mo’s trap had just about all of us dulled out.

Just wait. Mo II may yet revert to Mo I ways, given half an excuse.

by Elsker on Jun 4, 2010 3:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Mo I Versus Mo II

   I really hope against hope the old style dull Canes approach doesn’t resurface. I am really fine with the new version – as long as the team has fast, physical players on the ice. In fact, when it works, it’s magic and really brings the crowd entirely into the game. Given the fact they are playing a ton of young, hungry, fast, kids who love to hit, and we have Ruutu the human hit machine, I doubt we’ll see slow down hockey. To do so would be for Maurice to give a post-dated letter of resignation because there is no may Jim Rutherford is going to let the Caniacs enthusiasm get destroyed.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 3:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Human hit machine is coming off major shoulder surgery. I’m keeping my fingers crossed that he can recover to that form, but I have to admit I’m a tad pessimistic, especially early in the season.

Phoblographer and Finn Aficionado
SISU

by Jamie Kellner on Jun 4, 2010 4:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

Human Hitting Machine

  One reason I am hopeful the Hurricanes draft Johansen and that they give Osala and Bowman plenty of time at Carolina is that I am hoping they will take some of the hitting burden off of Ruutu.

by abramsdoug on Jun 4, 2010 6:15 PM EDT up reply actions  

you under estimate JR and Mo's friendship

Mo was probably done in Hockey as a head coach till JR brought him back…if JR fires him again it would be the end for sure…JR just does not have the will to do that to Mo…sorry but we are stuck with him for better or worse till there is a way to get him out while saving face for Mo….who knows what, when or how that can happen????

by Caniac324 on Jun 7, 2010 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

Winning on the Cheap

The reality is that JR agreed to long term and expensive deals with Cam Ward and Eric
based on a higher team budget. Now the budget is slashed and the obligations to those players remain. During his phone interview with Adam Gold, JR (with unusual candor) admitted that PK’s statements were news to him.

The other aspect that neither JR nor PK will bring up is the lost revenue because the team failed to make the playoffs . !8,000 seats @ at average $100/ticket = $1,800,000 gross
revenue. If the team goes two rounds into the playoffs, they are close to breakeven.

Last (but not least) , the recent public comments by JR and PK about Lavy are a dissapointment. JR was lukewarm (“playoffs are what he is good at”) and PK even worse. Lavy led the team to a Cup and deserves the respect he earned from team officials. If the Hurricanes management does not share the affection so many fans have for Lavy, they can at least act with class.

by JohnSS on Jun 4, 2010 4:07 PM EDT reply actions  

I agree with you. The comments from the Canes organization about Lavi are simply childish! And good point on the Ward and Staal contracts. I think a lot of people forget that Staal signed his contract before the economic downturn, when the salary cap was making big jumps for a couple of seasons. If things had continued on that path, Staal’s contract would not be in the top 5 of the league.

Triple Gold Juice - It's Potent and Guaranteed to Help You Score!

by PackPride17 on Jun 4, 2010 5:49 PM EDT up reply actions  

8000 seats

but we must not forget how much rent is on the rbcc…as the rent goes on 247 365…so a possible 1mill eight hundred grand goes towards “over head”…which is or could be anything…can the canes win and be cheap too….anythingis possible…bu many of us know better..time to go face off is next…….

Freedom Isn't Free, Someone Paid For It !
And if it Aint Hockey,It Aint Nothin !!

by CaniacSteve on Jun 4, 2010 8:05 PM EDT reply actions  

If the Canes are looking at being profitable by reducing salary, what does that mean for the free agents next season? I’m sure Cole, Brindy, and Sammy will be gone. What about LaRose, Jussi, and Joni? Jussi and Joni will be looking decent increases, does that mean they’ll be gone? We also have to factor in significant Salary increases to Staal & Ward and Sutter will also be in for a big raise. This is where going cheap turns us into the Florida Panthers.

Triple Gold Juice - It's Potent and Guaranteed to Help You Score!

by PackPride17 on Jun 4, 2010 9:38 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Exactly, we may be able to afford to be cheap while we have young guys like Bowman, Sutter, Dalpe, McBain, ect. making next to nothing… But in 1-2 years when they will all require multi-million dollar raises we will be waiving goodbye to ALL of them if we want to stay $10-15 million under the Cap. We will be lucky to keep Sutter alone.

by JussiJuice on Jun 6, 2010 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

15 Million cut in expenses?

GULP! if that is just salaries, it will be very hard to do (if strictly followed). however there was a modifier (about), and there are other expenses (but i’ve no idea how much could come from those things, or what is even likely). so let’s see where we get by making a few assumptions. we trade Cole, Samsonov (or buyout etc) for picks/ pucks, we DON’T resign Whitney, and we DON’T resign Picard/ Pothier! Then if we pick up, or bring up cheap replacements we get close to 15 Mil. saved!!! BUT WE’RE SCREWED!!!- at least this year…
Our young F need the veteran leadership (and assists) from Ray! Our D will have Carson or Babs in the 2nd pairing, w/ Harrison or ? in 3rd. Does this sound realistic, or did i forget something?

by randycane on Jun 5, 2010 3:44 PM EDT reply actions  

Bait and switch?

Sure would have been nice to know we were cutting the salary budget by $15M before we made our STH purchases.

I’ve been a STH for a decade, through more bad years than good. But the number of extra tickets in my package varies from season to season…and might have been different this year if it had been made clear we’re going cheap and rebuilding.

Oh, well. Yet another season with a stack of unused tickets at it’s end…just like this past one.

by Elsker on Jun 5, 2010 4:50 PM EDT reply actions  

Tailgate

Thank heavens for tailgating…when it gets bad on the ice, we can go outside and get a brew out of the ice!!!

by randycane on Jun 5, 2010 5:14 PM EDT up reply actions  

  I thought the hockey being played by the Hurricanes in January through April was really fun to watch and was far, far better than the first 27 games. As I recall the Hurricanes won four games out of the first 27 games. We went from four full STH packs to 5 STH packages this year in large part to help with the need to get more STH tickets sold. I imagine there are a wide range of reasons why very dedicated fans may elect to miss some games; but for me, I was much happier watching the combination of young players and core team players than what I thought was half-hearted veterans who were slow, non-physical, and seemingly far less committed to the F/M/R/B system that I saw during the first thirty games.

    This past season was a celebration for me because it was the last season I had to watch Wallin on defense. Next season will be celebration no matter what happens because it will be the absolute last season I have to watch Brind’Amour failing on the ice. Even if the Hurricanes have a dismal year in 2010-2011, it will simply set the stage further for more talent being brought to the team in the draft and much, much better days ahead.

   As for me, any reason that influenced the Hurricanes organization to go with its young talent was great with me; and if that meant the over all salary expense was dropped to do so, I am really happy. A. Ward’s salary was basically worse than a waste of money, for example. Much of what I see happening is addition by subtraction; and if only Brind’Amour can be bought out, there is nobody left on the team who really shouldn’t be on an NHL team.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 5:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

I will continue to support this team even if we are not shooting for the Cup (unless they piss me off and trade Staal, I have a deal with the Ticket Director on that one, :D ). I am discouraged that they will be scaling back, mainly because I think they are just 2 or 3 above average players away from making a real run. While I agree with AD that there is a real possibility of addition by subtraction, I think they could add a good young player to help out with the development of the kids. I feel the organization is going to heavily dependent on the young players performance and I don’t feel that is a smart move. They could ease the kids into the system, but instead they are planning a trail by fire. I know you love the “youngins” AD, but I just feel a little let down by the organization.

Triple Gold Juice - It's Potent and Guaranteed to Help You Score!

by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 6:19 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Business Side of the Equation

   I would love for the Hurricanes organization to have the fan support they need and therefore the revenue they need to add a player. I see the business side of the equation. The minority share needs to be sold. The fan base is what it is; and the major recession hurt the Hurricanes. If the fan base filled the RBC, the Hurricanes organization could and would be able to find another player or perhaps two via UFA or RFA or an attractive trade.

   I hold Laviolette and his decision to play injured veterans over the last four or five games of the 2007-2008 season responsible for the failure of the Hurricanes to make the playoffs and the resulting financial hit. In my view this next season, 2010-2011 is a necessary stage in the over all development of the franchise. The organization needs 4,000 to 5,000 more STHs to be able to project a cap or near cap expenditure each year. Peter Karmanos has to find the right buyer or buyers and making the franchise financially stable is a key component.

   Absolutely, if cost were no object, one would want to have an experienced player or two to add to the team and to give the younger players less pressure to produce this season. It is what it is; and there is plenty of blame to go around in terms of the lack of consistent fan support sufficient to support a near cap or cap expenditure. As long as the Hurricanes keep the core team together and the young prospects, the Hurricanes have a very bright future. Success could come sooner than some people think.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 7:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I think that this plan of going cheaper will only hurt the STH numbers. Coming off a disappointing season, going cheap IMO is not going to win fans over. I think making a trade for a good player like Sharp, Hemsky, Krejci, etc; show the fans that will reducing payroll, the Canes are still trying to put a winner on the ice. Simply depending on the kids to grow up quick and producing gives the idea to most fans that its going to be a long year (maybe more than 1) and that is what is discouraging to me.

Triple Gold Juice - It's Potent and Guaranteed to Help You Score!

by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 8:22 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

4-5K more STH’s is a few seasons away, at best, and will be when ticket prices skyrocket (supply/demand). But, that future is not soon.

Box office sales are far more profitable, just not as predictable. However, it’s also something which can occur sooner than STH growth. Failure to have someone qualified in charge of business operations continues to haunt Gale Force.

by Elsker on Jun 5, 2010 8:25 PM EDT up reply actions  

Why just blame Lavi?

As a physical therapist, and I assume this is true with Friesen as the PT and athletic trainer and conditioning guru – if he (and the medical staff) cleared the players for contact, then the “percentages” decision would be to insert them into the lineup. (Kind of like the argument against Duke missing the 2nd free throw to go up 3 point at end of NCAA championship). I don’t blame Lavi for doing that. It was the right decision, but the wrong outcome.

Go Canes!

by ivyleager on Jun 6, 2010 9:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

I respectfully disagree. My belief in sports is that if the chemistry is working, you don’t change it. The entire team was playing better for whatever reason with the Rats in and the veterans’ injured. It seemed like nonsense to me that when the Hurricanes had to win one of four of their last games to be in the playoffs that a coach should have kept the winning combination on the ice until and unless they clinched the playoff. Once a playoff spot was obtained, Lavi could have inserted one veteran at a time. As it was, Lavi threw in veterans who played terribly and the team confidence and chemistry vanished. It was a decision that I thought was unforgivably arrogant at the time; and it wound up costing the organization millions of dollars. It also wound up costing Lavi his job; but as hockey fate had it, Lavi seems to be a better fit for Philadelphia than Carolina anyway.

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 9:51 AM EDT up reply actions  

But, again, that’s just your opinion, aided by 20-20 hindsight. The org (not just Lavi) did what every other org would do in that critical situation…played the vets once the trainers and players said they were good to go.

by Elsker on Jun 6, 2010 10:45 AM EDT up reply actions  

Laviolette and Respnosibility

  It is certainly my opinion. It is, however, an opinion that has expressed at the time by me. It was also as I recall a matter upon which Jim Rutherford and Laviolette disagreed; and unless I am mistaken in my recollection, that disagreement served as one of the reasons why Laviolette later was fired. I believe Laviolette was insistent on playing the veterans. As head coach, it was a matter for which he had to take responsibility. I also disagree that the Hurricanes as an organization did what every other organization would do by bring veterans back immediately. This issue, like quite a few others, are obviously matters of opinion upon which reasonable minds often disagree. They are personal opinions. It is worthwhile, however, to maintain historical accuracy and to avoid historical revisionism when feasible.

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 11:15 AM EDT up reply actions  

I would need to see evidence that JR disagreed with this decision, for I suspect this to be an example of revisionist history.

The reasons for the coaching change were myriad, not a single instance. Again, that R word.

by Elsker on Jun 6, 2010 1:02 PM EDT up reply actions  

It is my recollection. There were quite a number of reasons given as I recall, including the failure to have structure on the team, the difference in opinion as to the direction of the team between Jim Rutherford and Laviolette, the failure/refusal of Laviolette to hold exit interviews, the rigidity of Laviolette and his unwillingness to engage is meaningful discussions, Laviolette’s impetuousness in defining the “role” of players (including the apparent inability of Laviolette to maintain a working relationship with Belanger).

  I will stick with my recollection of events; but if you care to show me it is inaccurate, I would be very open to further information.

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 1:28 PM EDT up reply actions  

Some News Quotes

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/jim_kelley/12/04/laviolette.firing/

December 4, 2008

Laviolette had other problems according to Rutherford. Consistent slow starts, both in games and the schedule, cost the team dearly the last two seasons. Blowing a lead in 2007-08 and allowing the surging Capitals to not only gain a playoff spot but push the ‘Canes out of first place in the division and the postseason in the same run didn’t work in Lavilotte’s favor, either.

“He’s a good coach, but he’s by no means a great one and when he ran his course in Carolina, a place where neither management nor the players particularly cared for him, it was all over.”

Read More: http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/jim_kelley/12/04/laviolette.firing/#ixzz0q5zhykDL
Get a free NFL Team Jacket and Tee with SI Subscription

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 1:40 PM EDT up reply actions  

Good thing we got rid of Lavi and his slow starts… Our amazing start last season under Maurice sure got us places.

by JussiJuice on Jun 6, 2010 3:39 PM EDT up reply actions  

ROTFLMFAO!

How true, how true!!!!

Go Canes!

by ivyleager on Jun 6, 2010 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions  

“Bait and switch”?
Lets be honest here, the cup, all the conference finals, the miracle at molson, the shock at the rock, the scotty walker beating thomas, the cup, the conference finals, the cup, meeting ward after being down 2-0 to montreal at home…..shall I go on. The affordable tickets. 90 percent of this league would trade decades with ours. I wish I could afford your STH that you’da not got had you known they were gonna rebuild!

by TylerA7707 on Jun 5, 2010 10:29 PM EDT up reply actions  

There’s something far more going on here than a mere rebuild.

The shares are being positioned for sale. It has nothing to do with hockey and everything to do with accounting.

That’s why we’re “going cheap”.

by Elsker on Jun 5, 2010 10:57 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Finances of the Organization

   The fact remains that business model of the Hurricanes needed modification. Either the revenues needed to increase via increased STH participation in order to permit the organization to budget at or near the Salary Cap, or salary expenses had to be cut significantly. Depending on walk in traffic was not working as a business model. Obviously, the rebuild with new talent gave the organization a chance to temporarily lower the salary expense without devastating the team. Seriously, who would pay Samsonov $2.8 million if that were on the table today as opposed to when he was signed. Similarly, Brind’Amour at $3 million is a joke given how he is playing. Both negotiated their contracts and nobody is arguing that point. What is clear is that they are vastly overpaid today for what they bring today to the rink. Similarly, paying A. Ward over $2 million and Wallin almost $2 million and Walker over $2 million made no financial sense. Dead wood was cut away and the team improved in their absence.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 11:33 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don’t think anybody is arguing the fact of reducing payroll. My frustration is the SUGGESTED reduction by $10 to $15 million. I believe the Canes could ice a very competitive team (based on a few trades) for under $50 million, possibly slightly lower. We could have a team mixed with a couple of vets, a bunch of mid to late 20s guys, and 3 or 4 kids (5 if you include Sutter one of the kids). But this doesn’t seem to be the approach we are taking. Now there are still plenty of moves to be made, so I could be wrong. But based on the moves so far and the news/chats from the organization, it doesn’t appear that way.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 6, 2010 12:09 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Hurricanes Budget

Here are the figures for the Hurricanes from Cap Geek:

http://www.capgeek.com/charts.php?Team=10

It has the Hurricanes already committed to $41,908,333, not counting Boychuk, Dalpe, McBain, Bowman, Osala, Samson, Carson, Whitney, or Peters.

  I assume that the $15 million reduction as opposed to to the $10 million reduction would occur if Whitney were not resigned, and if Brind’Amour were bought out, and if Samsonov were traded.

    A $10 million reduction from a cap hit of approximately $56 million this year to $46 million seems hard, but not impossible. $48 million to $50 million seems the most likely result to me.

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 1:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

I think what it means is dumping salary at all costs instead of trying to add anything of significance.

Forget filling the holes that seriously need to be filled, we will be lucky if we keep the current roster in tact. This also pretty much assures we will be seeing plenty of Harrison next year, our defense will be no better (The key area I think that needs to be addressed) unless they trade up and Draft one of Fowler, Gudbranson, or Gormley. But doing that would assure we will never get a possible future first line winger in Connolly or Tarasenko, that is unless we tank again next year and grab another high Draft pick which is looking more and more likely.

by JussiJuice on Jun 6, 2010 1:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Dumping Salary

Thus far all I see are players’ salaries being dumped who were either awful, like A. Ward, Wallin, and Yelle; or replaceable like Walker, Alberts, Corvo, and Cullen. Who do you see on the current roster as essential and who is not going to be kept?

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 1:43 PM EDT up reply actions  

Very unfortunately, I think the Canes will be reluctant and not buy-out Brind’Amour. Given his recent comments, he will be playing for the Canes next year, so I wouldn’t count out his salary just yet.

Samsonov being traded would be a dream at best, we would probably have to give up a 2nd or 3rd round Draft pick just for a team to take him. He isn’t worth near what he is paid, I really doubt any team will be jumping to take him.

Karmanos said he wants to cut the salary by $10-15 million, which would mean a salary at the very most $46 million. As you said we have $41 million already spent not including Carson ($1.5 million estimated), Boychuk ($1.1 million), McBain ($.875k), Peters ($875k estimated) and Dalpe ($875k) at the very least. Add in their salaries and that puts us up near $46 million already without re-signing Whitney.

Without making any changes at all we are already at the self-stated budget maximum, including replacing Whitney with ??? and Pothier with Harrison. Do you really feel excited about that team?

by JussiJuice on Jun 6, 2010 3:54 PM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Why I Still am Excited About the Team

Yes, I am excited about the 2010-2011 Hurricanes, although I share real concerns about the Brind’Amour situation. Here are some of the reasons I am excited.

Boychuk: I really am impressed with his speed, his desire, and his fiesty nature. He is small, but he battles for every puck. He also has a history of makes big plays at times in the game. Here’s one example: 3/11/2010 against the Penguins. It is the first period. The Pens jumped on the Canes and ran off to a 2 to 0 lead at the RBC. Whitney comes back and scores on the power play in the first period, but the Penguins are beating us like a baseball bat beating a hanging carpet.

   With approximately 10:49 in the first period, Boychuk grabs the puck off a face-off, he freezes two defenders and back-hands a beautiful shot high into the net. Boychuk’s first goal in the NHL was also an amazing, if lucky, shot.

Carson: I really like how he plays. He has great positioning and poise. He doesn’t rock people’s worlds with massive hits, but he has excellent hands and vision on the ice.

McBain: McBain is going to be a very special player, I think. He has the ability to turn a game around with a pass or a shot. In money time, he wants the puck and he doesn’t choke.


   Dalpe
: Dalpe, too, has that special ability to win games with clutch plays. He is going to be an excellent player for the Hurricanes. It may well not be in 2010-2011, but at least by 2011-2012, he is going to be an impact player.

Tlusty I started following Tlusty as a potential Hurricanes player about a year or go more or less. He has speed, size, and a great hockey mind. He is happy to give or take a hit, and I think the physicality of his play will increase as he gets stronger. Osala Osala made very impressive strides since being obtained. Daniels has done a great job with him. Osala had an excellent world championship and was a beast with hits. If the message is driven home with Osala that he needs to take the hitting load off Ruutu and if he responds with being a beast in front of the net, he will really help this team. Bowman I’ve followed Bowman’s play since before the draft year. He is quiet but tremendously determined. He, too, has improved tremendously since coming to the Rats. He has the will to win and has a scorer’s touch. He also has dramatically increased and improved his hitting game. Again, I don’t know that he will take a spot out of training camp, but he is going to be an excellent player for the Hurricanes.


   Sutter
: Sutter is the real deal. He plays an amazing game and is a much better scorer than some people thought. As he fills out, he could be frighteningly good.

   The Core Veterans
If I were a GM and could build a team around core veterans, I would love to have Staal, Ward, Ruutu, Jokinen, Gleason, and Pitkanen. Every one of those players are Olympic team quality. Add Sutter, who is now a veteran in my book, and things look great.

   What Worries Me:

   I am worried about the first line if Whitney doesn’t sign. I am worried about Harrison. Harrison had a poor year both at the NHL level and the AHL level; and although the Hurricanes organization has been clear he was injured, I still have concerns about Harrison. The power play worries me. Last season, the power play was not good enough for the Hurricanes to make it into the playoffs. Unless, the new kids and Babchuk provide some more fire power, the lack of a strong power play could be a serious problem. Brind’Amour worries me. His presence is a distraction that nobody needs. He may be a locker room leader, but on the ice he couldn’t out skate a goalie. The draft worries me. I know some people have concluded they want a defenseman; but I am concerned that unless the Hurricanes get a top tier big, fast, forward, the team will not be able to compete consistenly. The third line center worries me. Unless Dalpe comes through, it looks light at third line center. Dwyer is an excellent player, but I really prefer him at wing or fourth line center.

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 4:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

The problem with going cheap one year is; there is always another excuse to go cheap again. This “going cheap” is not likely a one year flash; if it happens, it will be a multi-year thing. Building around your core is the way to go, but how are we going to keep the core together. Between Staal, Ruutu, Gleason, and Ward; their salaries jump between 10/11 & 11/12 by $2.4M. After next season Sutter, Jussi, and Joni will all be expecting raises. Sutter by probably $2M +, Jussi and Joni by $1M + each. If Seids can get $3.25M and Volchenkov could get $5M, what can a point producing defenseman get; $6M?

The organization needs to spend money to keep this team competitive. If the STH are not working out, they need to find another form of revenue. Maybe they need to lower prices to some tickets to get people in the building, spending money, watching hockey. Maybe they need to sell advertising on everything they can find. I really don’t know, but something has to be done.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 6, 2010 5:27 PM EDT up reply actions  

Did you guys see Seidenberg was signed to a 4 year, $13M contract? He’ll be making more than Tim Gleason! I like Seids, but I don’t know if he’s woth $3.25M a year.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 5, 2010 9:50 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Seidenberg: 4 Years, $13 million - a deal made over lots of wine or something

   Some deals make me stop and scratch my head. This deal with Seidenberg was one of them. I have to believe somebody was not cold sober when that deal went down.

by abramsdoug on Jun 5, 2010 10:41 PM EDT up reply actions  

Fixing the Power Play

   I have been a man on a mission on the issue of fixing the Hurricanes’ power play. It is so astonishingly obvious that in 2007-2008 when the Hurricanes missed the playoffs by one win, in 2008-2009 when they lost to the Pens, and in 2009-2001 that the Hurricanes’ inability to have a 20% plus power play killed them.

   It is equally painfully evident that the Hurricanes needed somebody like McBain and Babchuk who get get pucks to the net; and in the case of Babchuk who could make it too dangerous personally for defensemen to lose track of him at the point – thereby giving the forwards slightly more time and space to work. The lack of a big, strong forward who could screen the goalie and deflect pucks into the net further hurt the Hurricanes power play. The Hurricanes’ passing was often extremely tentative and they signaled where they were going to pass the puck too often; and McBain’s ability to see the ice and not telegaph his passes made a tremendous difference. The lack of a forward who could control the puck and take it to the net on the power play, thereby forcing defenders to get out of the passing lanes also hurt the Hurricanes’ power play.

   The large forward issue is not solved by the players on the roster at this point. I am hopeful Osala will get a chance to play at Carolina and that they will use him to play that role. The other possibility is that a player like Connolly, Niederreiter, or Johansen might be ready for that role; but that is asking a tremendous amount of a 18 year old player.

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 9:46 AM EDT reply actions  

Agree.

I can’t really see what good Francis has been doing on the power play side of things for the past year+. There are some things that just can’t be taught, or there are some people who instinctively know how it’s done but can’t for the life of them teach it (insert Gretzky here).

Hopefully having The Chuck back on the point blasting the hell out of the puck, it’ll open up other options.

FWIW, one of my favorite quotes about hockey recently has been from Theo Fluery’s book, “Systems don’t win hockey games. You know how you beat another team? You outplay them.” Systems in his mind suck the wind/life right out of a player, especially a scorer. He also wrote about how great it is to play with the young guys just coming up and their energy level. Wise words.

Go Canes!

by ivyleager on Jun 6, 2010 10:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Skating Down Hill

   For me, hockey is like a second language so I see it in terms of its relationship to other sports; and I look for patterns like in a tapestry. As a result, one thing I look for is which team is skating down hill. The team that seems to have magnets for the puck and the puck is always coming to them and the team that is pushing the pace while maintaining structure in their five player positioning almost always seems to me.

   I don’t personally put much blame on Francis for the power play’s poor performance. The reason is I didn’t see how the personnel we had could match up on power plays that well until (1) McBain was brought up; and (2) Sutter was given time on the power play. When that happened and while Ruutu was semi-healthy the power play functioned quite well.

   Another area that really hurt the Hurricanes this year on the power play is that they had nobody who excelled in deflecting pucks into the net while playing with their back to the goalie. Those greasy goals are essential. During the entire season I can only recall Dwyer with one such goal on a deflection and Whitney also had one such goal. At their listed heights of 5’10" and 180 lbs (generous measurements I feel confident), they don’t strike in the hearts of goalies as they try to screen a goalie.

   Also from other sports like basketball, if you put two players on the court or on the ice, much more often than night, the player that has an insatiable desire to win more often than not will figure out a win to win the 50-50 puck or ball. Some players spend their careers with a burning hunger to win each contested one on one battle; while others see the game as a work of art in which they are the painter. I will take a warrior like Ruutu or Gleason every time in any sport over the Semin’s of the sporting world.

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 10:18 AM EDT up reply actions  

Sorry AD

I object !! ywhile sports is just that “sports” but aside from the NFL…you’ll not find a harder hitting faster sport except for auto or drag racing…you can’t comaore or lump together sports as a whole like that …while on paper or theoretically speaking you maybe correct but from the physical action and phusics of the games…Hockey can and is more brutal in the types and severity of injuries to players…after all NFL players have a longer life span than NHL players do these days as well…i gots to run…have 3 more Honey Do tasks to accomplish…;-}

Freedom Isn't Free, Someone Paid For It !
And if it Aint Hockey,It Aint Nothin !!

by CaniacSteve on Jun 6, 2010 10:41 AM EDT reply actions  

young guns

these guys (like sutter) i think are really going to surprise management and coaches with how well they do. we were so weighted down by our slower beat up exhausted vets that it cost us 14 straight games. but these younger kids i really think will at least keep us in the game to vie for a place in the playoffs. i truly believe they can do it. and they have got to convince brind’amour to retire. he is dead weight and his salary isn’t helping our money woes.

by emmarose on Jun 6, 2010 6:15 PM EDT reply actions  

Hey you finally have got someone to support your point of view! Just kidding around AD. :D

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by PackPride17 on Jun 6, 2010 7:03 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

I noticed I had at least one person agreeing with me. It’s a start, right?

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 7:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

While you know that I don’t agree with your idea of how the Canes should be organized/approach next season, your thoughts have merit. The organization seems to somewhat agree with you; rolling the dice with the kids. I just prefer to play poker than roulette. Both games (methods) are gambling, but I would rather know what cards I hold than just spinning a ball on a numbered wheel.

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by PackPride17 on Jun 6, 2010 7:15 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Some Additonal Thoughts

  I’d love for the Canes to be able to afford to bring in an experienced defenseman; but I can’t see that happening unless there is a new partner who gives the green light. What I don’t understand about the naysayers for the Hurricanes is that the same players on defense who are felt to be dangerous on the ice, were extremely effective despite injuries to Gleason and Corvo. Harrison certainly left me pondering the nature of life at times, but to my eyes he was 1,000 times better than A. Ward or Wallin; and he was not as likely to give a puck gift to an opposing forward in his own end as Alberts. I found nothing at all bad with Carson’s play or McBain’s play. Gleason and Pitkanen are excellent. Babchuk is an offensive threat, and I thought he did much better on defense than many others seem to think. He had his share of mistakes, but he often remedied them by having arms the length of an oak tree’s branches. Is anybody really arguing that we need Aaron Ward to return or Wallin or Alberts? So why all the doom and gloom about the defense?

by abramsdoug on Jun 6, 2010 11:50 PM EDT up reply actions  

Say our likely defense next year is:

Gleason/McBain
Carson/Pitkanen
Babchuk/Harrison

Do I think it is necessarily a BAD defense? No. But this D is not half as good as serious Cup contending teams. If I were comparing, I’d say that D is bottom third in the league and certainly not a defense I’d feel even remotely comfortable with heading into the playoffs. I feel Carson is overslotted for his development as well as McBain, as usual we are asking too much from kids not ready for their position. I like Babchuk, but he needs someone to help him out defensively and Harrison is not that person.

Too young, too inexperienced, and again we will rely far too heavily on Gleason and Pitkanen to play 25-30 minutes a night. God forbid one of them go down with injury, McBain and Carson in the top-4 is a stretch already and we certainly don’t have any backup D that could step into that role.

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 4:48 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I don’t think it is coincidence that “rolling the dice on the kids” just happens to be the cheapest possible route.

I’m excited about the young kids too, but the better they do the more certain it will be that we cannot afford to keep them. I don’t believe this cost cutting will be a one year deal, Cup contending teams are not the teams that are struggling to cut $10-15 million in Salary in the off-season.

In all certainty at least one and probably two of Pitkanen, Sutter, and Jokinen will be headed onto teams that will pay them what they deserve next year as the Canes can’t afford to keep them. AD, you say that winning will bring the fans, but to win we need to have a competitive team. We can’t fill the glaring holes in our first line and top-4 D AND severely cut costs, it simply can’t be done.

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 4:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

A Couple Questions

   I wonder why you say the defense of

Gleason/McBain
Carson/Pitkanen
Babchuk/Harrison

 is not capable of playing solid defense. Are there any games played in 2009-2010 with that basic line up (Pothier for Babchuk) in which the defense collapsed and which you can reference so I can go take another look? Basically this defense, when healthy, did a very reasonable job and was one reason the team played well even with Cam Ward injured. The issue of injuries is far more troubling. I am hoping the Hurricanes will re-sign Picard as insurance against injuries. Bellemore is actually quite solid and should be ok to spell a 5-6 pairing for short-term stints with the team. If two defensemen get injured, things looks far more questionable.

   I remain cautiously optimistic that the new minority owner or owners will complete their purchases before the end of August and that Jim Rutherford will be given a greenlight to take on a veteran on defense; however, the sad result of the Aaron Ward experiment makes me wonder if there isn’t some method to the madness of avoiding veteran defensemen who aren’t committed to the M/F/R/B approach.

   I do think the Hurricanes solution is in winning and in playing hard-nosed, fast, intense hockey at the RBC. Finally, although I hesitate to make this statement now, if the Hurricanes have a great draft this year, if the Hurricanes finished with the #7 pick in 2010-2011, with the picks they have, they can focus on picking hordes of defensemen. The painful result of two tanked seasons would be a level of talent that would last them for at least 5 to 8 years. Boston has a superabundance of talent in their system which they will soon be able to trade for more talent. I really think the young kids will come through and even the skeptics will be as appeased as a skeptic can be. The only downside is a rebuilding year and the accumulation of even more talent in the system.

by abramsdoug on Jun 7, 2010 6:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

Picard is your answer for the inevitable injury ( or injuries) in the top 4? Yikes!

And you’re saying that picking up vets is dangerous because they might not buy into our rather simple D scheme? Do you remember Poither talking about how much easier our scheme was than Washington’s? Do you think he did not buy in?

Poither would make me feel a lot better about the top 4 and injuries…but he’s still not what we need.

by Elsker on Jun 7, 2010 8:49 AM EDT up reply actions  

the defense doing a “reasonable job” doesn’t win Cups. Name me one team that made the Playoffs with a defense with that little experience. 4 of 6 of those players have only one or less full years of NHL experience!

Picard is your solution to filling out our top-4 when Gleason/Pitkanen get injured?? Really?

Look at Philadelphia and Chicago’s defense, those are two extremely solid, veteran, gritty defenses. Those two defenses are at least twice, probably five times better than the defense we both have listed. Carson, Babchuk (maybe as a PP specialist), and especially Harrison wouldn’t even touch their 3rd pairings if they were on their teams.

I agree the defense may be “suitable” for going .500, but it is clearly not anywhere near a Cup built defense, probably not even a Playoff built defense.

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 9:00 AM EDT up reply actions  

“Are there any games played in 2009-2010 with that basic line up (Pothier for Babchuk) in which the defense collapsed and which you can reference so I can go take another look?”

The Boston game with 3 SH goals on the same PK comes to mind…

by webbo26 on Jun 7, 2010 7:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

Boston Game

  I actually have watched the Boston game you are referencing three different times on video. The defense was playing quite well. The power play was terrible and it was the first time I saw McBain make a rookie mistake – which absolutely is going to happen.

http://gamecenter.nhl.com/nhlgc/console.jsp?intcmpid=nhl.com:gcl:vdsbnv&nav-video-gcl

To verify that I was not in a state of self-delusion, I went back to the link above to watch that sequence again:

Goal 1: short side shot took Cam Ward by surprise. Not really a terrible play by McBain and Rodney, just a very, very soft goal let in by Cam Ward.

Goal 2: Simple play behind the net. Cam Ward gets the puck and passes it directly to a Boston player at the half wall. (2nd period 18:39) Pass to the slot. Goal. There was a mental lapse by the defense in not calling for the puck, but really the second goal was on Cam Ward and a terrible pass.

Goal 3: Pretty weak pass into the offensive zone. Boston breaks out. Rodney probably leaves slightly too much of a gap; but Cam Ward also let in a soft goal.

  The point to me in watching that game at the time and in the various times was it looked like Cam Ward was not comfortable in the net. It was one of the worst moments of the year for the Hurricanes, but I could be at most one goal on the defense and the other two were simply mind-meltdowns by Cam Ward.

by abramsdoug on Jun 7, 2010 9:20 PM EDT up reply actions  

The half-full view

Here’s the best face I can put on things:

- If the “el cheapo” version of the team can somehow get into the mix (more on this below), then PK might see fit to let JR be a buyer, instead of a seller, at the trade deadline and bring in those huge missing parts with playoff revenue in mind (just not sure how the estate sale affects this option)

- Maybe JR is indeed moving up on draft day to grab a D prospect that could start top 4 (only on our team could this happen!) so that we actually have something resembling a NHL defense and can then make bullet one happen

- Maybe JR has one big trade cooking that can bring a real NHL D-first defenseman that can add some real grit and clear a crease instead of just watching *cough*Babchuk*cough*, thereby perhaps allowing bullet one to happen

- Otherwise…we watch the kids and speculate about our high draft pick next year about this time

by Elsker on Jun 6, 2010 9:04 PM EDT reply actions  

I seriously hope that point #2 will happen and I wouldn’t doubt it if that was JR’s plan after hearing of all the budget cuts. I think that would be by far the best case scenario given the “cheapo” route we have decided to take. Gudbranson, Fowler, or Gormley would be a serious boost to our defensive ranks, no doubt they would start in the top-4 (I agree, probably only on the Canes).

My salvage plan would be:

1) Trade up and pick up either Fowler or Gudbranson at the Draft who will play top-4 next year.
2) Pray one or two of the young guns can manage a 15-25 goal season so we can squeak into a Playoff spot
3) It pains me… But trade Pitkanen (since we won’t be able to afford him anyway and we have a replacement in Fowler/Gudbranson) at the trade deadline for a serious 1st line Winger
4) Trade for a suitable top-4 veteran D (nothing crazy, just a 2nd pairing guy) at the trade deadline to shore up the defense
5) Head into the Playoffs and hope for some magic to happen

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 5:01 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

Canes Review at CBSSports

Here’s an interesting review on the Canes by CBSSports:

http://www.cbssports.com/nhl/teams/report/CAR/13489517/hurricanes-report-roster?source=rss_teams_Carolina_Hurricanes&utm_source=twitterfeed&utm_medium=twitter

 Interesting observations by CBSSports on the Canes. Among the points raised, and there were far more:

MOST VALUABLE PLAYER
LW Jussi Jokinen was consistent for most of the season….

MOST DISAPPOINTING PLAYER
C Rod Brind’Amour’s stellar career hit a major decline. He battled inconsistency and spent most of the latter part of the season on the fourth line…

by abramsdoug on Jun 7, 2010 6:31 AM EDT reply actions  

Negativitity@$!* Enuff

Ok i understand the Canes had a real bad year, and the BUDGET looks pretty iffy! That said, has anyone sat down, dispassionately and taken one player (position) at a time and analyzed what is the likelyhood that this position will be better, same, or worse?
I think you might find we have a surprising-looking upside! Even w/o doing that, with all the “bad plays and players” last year it would seem it would be hard to duplicate that poor level, eh?!! Let’s take Staal and Ward for starters: do you expect them to be worse, same, or better this year? Go ahead and do your analysis, and then come back and tell me THE SKY IS FALLING!!!

by randycane on Jun 7, 2010 8:01 AM EDT reply actions  

If I’m Staal and Ward I’m a bit upset that there is no team support for me as I enter the prime of my career. They are probably just as disappointed as we are by the going cheap news

by Elsker on Jun 7, 2010 8:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

By most of JR’s comments, he too seems pretty damn disappointed.

Personally I’m very disappointed. I agree, our team has an AMAZING upside with tons of young, cheap players that could break-out (possibly). Currently, I think we have one of the best make-ups we have had in years AND $10-15 million in Cap space. If we could spend to the Cap again and fill our blaring needs for a top-4 D and a top-6 Winger (which would be easily had with the Cap space we have), I’d say no question we would be a Playoff contender.

The unfortunate fact, however, is that they have decided to go the cheap route. Karmanos is more worried about cutting costs than putting a good product on the ice, how could you not be disappointed by that?

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 9:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

The thing is, we don’t even have to spend to the cap. If we made some intelligent moves and brought in a few key players, we would be a playoff team and still be at around $50M salary & cap.

Triple Gold Juice - It's Potent and Guaranteed to Help You Score!

by PackPride17 on Jun 7, 2010 12:02 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

I think that could happen too… But $50 million would only be $6 million under where we were last year, not $10-15 million.

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 1:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

i’ve heard all that B4!! can you not see Staal and Ward (to start) are likely to have better years?

by randycane on Jun 7, 2010 9:25 AM EDT reply actions  

Listen to most of yall! The pessimism around here is insane! Im running away before it starts rubbing off on me! “…woulda thought twice about my ST’s”, “……not a top 4 NHL D”, “……not a playoff D”. Some of yall even have it in you to go ahead and start bitching about whats gonna happen 3 or 4 years down the road! “….once the young kids do good, we cant afford to keep em….” REALLY! You wanna pull for a big boy team that spends to the cap every year, brings in big name players every offseason, go join the Rangers. They always bring in someone like Gabby or Redden to fix their problems, they always challenge for the cup. Go pull for Vancouver, or a big spending team like Toronto. Hey, you want top 6 forwards?, you want a “true” NHL D? San Jose’s deeper than the Pacific Ocean, go sip from their cup. As for me Im proud of what this franchise has accomplished in the past 10 years, Im proud of the resiliency they showed last season, and Im excited about the future…..okay Im done, yall can continue your complain-fest now…..

by TylerA7707 on Jun 7, 2010 9:27 AM EDT reply actions  

When was the last time Karmanos said he wanted to cut salary by $10-15 million? The Canes have never been a team to spend to the Cap, but I can’t remember the last time they cut that much in one year. That takes us from the middle of the pack in spending among the NHL (where much of the success you mention has come from) to the very bottom. Look at the teams that stay $10-15 million under Cap every year, I don’t think you will recognize many Playoff contenders.

Personally I pay good money for season tickets… I apologize but I think I have a right to complain when I feel that instead of trying to put the best possible team together, instead management is scrambling to cut as many costs as they can.

Not to mention I’m sure this will also mean $11 beers and $6 hot-dogs at the games next year.

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 9:36 AM EDT up reply actions   1 recs

I agree, if I was sitting on my couch watching every game on TV… I think I would care a lot less.

However a month after paying for my full-season tickets, hearing a press-release that the team has gone from spending to the Cap limit to a Cap bottom-feeder… That annoys me.

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 9:41 AM EDT up reply actions  

If they spent money and brought in a bunch of players, I can guarantee you’d complain about the youth not getting a chance. As I said, complain away brotha!

by TylerA7707 on Jun 7, 2010 9:59 AM EDT up reply actions  

There is plenty of room for both, take a look at the roster and get back to me.

by JussiJuice on Jun 7, 2010 3:16 PM EDT up reply actions  

Well, in all fairness, JR and PK always do exactly what they tell the media they’re going to do.

Phoblographer and Finn Aficionado
SISU

by Jamie Kellner on Jun 7, 2010 11:44 AM EDT reply actions  

Ray Whitney, as predicted, moves onward

Canes Now posting confirms:

http://bit.ly/9sVkTs

So… no secret agreement, eh? Turns out it’s just business, as usual.

by Elsker on Jun 7, 2010 3:42 PM EDT reply actions  

PLOY?? We'll see in July...???

After reading the report it doesn’t sound good, but I wouldn’t say it’s anywhere near a done deal!
I’m hoping IT’S JUST BUSINESS (negotiation tactics), but ???

by randycane on Jun 7, 2010 4:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

It seems you were right all along about Whitney.

by abramsdoug on Jun 7, 2010 5:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

PK- ANOTHER DUMB OWNER...

He should learn when to keep his mouth shut!! Telling the world that he wants to SAVE 10-15 million, sure will help drive away any players who want to make more than MINIMUM WAGE!!! Who will want to buy a team that can’t win (worthless)?? URGGGGG!!!!

by randycane on Jun 7, 2010 4:53 PM EDT reply actions  

If the Canes are going cheap, wouldn’t it be wise to trade TK? Vancouver is looking for solid 3rd line & 4th line checkers / penalty killers and he does have an affordable contract. While I think TK has some value on the Canes, we could replace him with Samson for about half the price. We would be losing a little on that deal, but it would save about $500K. We might be able to pick up a mid round pick also.

Triple Gold Juice - It's Potent and Guaranteed to Help You Score!

by PackPride17 on Jun 7, 2010 8:20 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Who has hijacked your account? :-D

Unless we’re totally tanking the season, retaining TK’s affordable contract delivers a NHL defender that has at least seen the ways of those he is assigned to defend. That role player thing we were trying to remind AD was essential, remember?

Plus, Mr. Gleason thanks you in advance for keeping him on the roster. LOL!

by Elsker on Jun 7, 2010 9:05 PM EDT up reply actions  

Some of Us Might Call It Pure Logic

   I guess it all depends on one’s perspective. I think TK is a player who may well find himself on the trade block due to the fight finances for the reasons PackPride17 mentions. Samson is about half the price. I thought the idea was that Samson and TK were “role” players and that they got relatively few minutes but had a job to perform.

  Accordingly, I don’t see how trading TK is a sign that the Hurricanes intend to tank the season. If the season rises or falls on the difference between TK and Samson, all is lost anyway because that is a mighty, mighty thin wire to skate.

by abramsdoug on Jun 7, 2010 9:23 PM EDT up reply actions  

AD, its not “pure logic.”. Its the fact that tight-ass PK plans to give JR nothing to work with, so he (we) must become creative to figure a way to get assets that will improve this team.

From his inappropriate comments about Lavi to the drastic payroll reduction, I am growing less and less fond of PK by the day.

Triple Gold Juice - It's Potent and Guaranteed to Help You Score!

by PackPride17 on Jun 7, 2010 9:35 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

Pure Logic with the Budgetary Constraints Being Imposed

How about this statement: The approach is logical within the confines of the very strict budgetary constraints being imposed on Jim Rutherford?

by abramsdoug on Jun 7, 2010 9:38 PM EDT up reply actions  

Elsker, I know its out of the norm for me to suggest this, but the team seems to be in financial disaster or something. How else would you justify reducing payroll by upwards of $15M? I have made a post of the Whitney thread with some other ideas. My thought is to cut back bottom 6 players so they may be filled by the kids rather than force the kids into top 9, top 6 roles. Also, if we reduce enough at the bottom, maybe we can acquire AT LEAST one good player to help out Staal, Sutter, Ruutu, and Jokinen.

Triple Gold Juice - It's Potent and Guaranteed to Help You Score!

by PackPride17 on Jun 7, 2010 9:41 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

It won’t matter who you scrape up off the bottom of the offensive barrel if our net is being filled with pucks because we have no experienced defenders.

I’m back on my bait/switch horse. Changed conditions may now necessitate a re-evaluation of my financial commitment to the team.

If PK wants to lessen the value of the entertainment product, then perhaps I need to fund a few less free passes for my employees and guests.

And that, fellow fans, is exactly how the downward spiral begins. The All-Star game may save them this season…but then what?

by Elsker on Jun 7, 2010 11:45 PM EDT up reply actions  

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Carolina Hurricanes Roster

# Pos. DOB W H
Bryan Allen 5 D 8/21/1980 226 6-5
Brian Boucher 33 G 1/2/1977 200 6-2
Drayson Bowman 21 C 3/8/1989 190 6-1
Tim Brent 37 C 3/10/1984 188 6-0
Patrick Dwyer 39 RW 6/22/1983 175 5-11
Justin Faulk 28 D 3/20/1992 205 6-0
Tim Gleason 6 D 1/29/1983 217 6-0
Jay Harrison 44 D 11/3/1982 211 6-4
Jussi Jokinen 36 LW 4/1/1983 198 5-11
Derek Joslin 27 D 3/17/1987 210 6-1
Chad LaRose 59 LW 3/27/1982 181 5-10
Jamie McBain 4 D 2/25/1988 200 6-2
Andreas Nodl 14 RW 2/28/1987 196 6-1
Justin Peters 60 G 8/30/1986 205 6-1
Joni Pitkanen 25 D 9/19/1983 210 6-3
Tuomo Ruutu 15 LW 2/16/1983 200 6-0
Jeff Skinner 53 RW 5/16/1992 193 5-11
Jaroslav Spacek 8 D 2/11/1974 210 6-0
Eric Staal 12 C 10/29/1984 205 6-4
Anthony Stewart 13 C 1/5/1985 230 6-3
Brandon Sutter 16 C 2/14/1989 183 6-3
Jiri Tlusty 19 C 3/16/1988 209 6-0
Cam Ward 30 G 2/29/1984 185 6-1

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