Jets Dump Hurricanes, 3-1
by Bob Wage on Nov 26, 2011 1:06 AM EST
in Carolina Hurricanes Game Recaps
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PrintThe Carolina Hurricanes and Winnipeg Jets are two teams ranked near the bottom of the league, each currently struggling to keep their heads above water. They faced each other on Friday night and the Jets came out on top, 3-1 in front of 15,718 at the RBC.
The loss puts the Hurricanes alone in last place in their division and second to last in the conference.
The visitors controlled play for most of the first 40 minutes, outshooting the home team by healthy margins each period, (14-7 and 13-4). But the score was close throughout and while the Canes tried to tie things up in the third period, their last ditch effort came up short.
Winnipeg would take a 1-0 lead on a perfect shot by Evander Kane late in the first period, but Jiri Tlusty tied things up early in the second with some nice puckhandling and a slick shot that surprised Jets goalie Chris Mason.
Andrew Ladd knocked in the game winner though after he out-battled Tomas Kaberle for the puck down low. Ladd's goal came just 1:08 after Tlusty scored.
Kaberle had another rough game, which included a missed chance on an open net in the third period.
The Canes pulled Cam Ward out of goal for an extra attacker with a minute and change to go, but the Jets scored an empty netter to close things out.
Next up for Carolina is an away game at Ottawa on Sunday.
Game Notes:
- Brian Boucher was hit in the face by a puck while sitting on the bench during the second period. Paul Maurice said that there was a lot of swelling, but he should be all right. He did not return to the bench for the third period so the team could treat and monitor the swelling.
- While being dominated stat wise for two periods, the Canes did control the puck in the third and made a good effort to tie things up, (10 shots to 3), but it was too little too late.
- The powerplay was 0-4 and failed to generate a shot on net during the last two tries. It is now rated near last in the league at a bit over 12%.
- Carolina was given credit for 27 hits, led by Brett Sutter with four.
- The Canes also had a total of 15 giveaways, led by Eric Staal with four. Maurice called out that stat as something that contributed to the loss. That and the fact the the team missed the net on 27 shots. Winnipeg had just two giveaways for the entire team.
- Staal had those four giveaways, just one shot on goal, and finished with a -1.
- The fourth line got more time in this one as each of them averaged about nine minutes of ice time apiece.
- Jamie McBain had a team high four blocked shots.
- The team finished at 50% in the faceoff circle led by Jussi Jokinen at 77%.
post game interviews
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Fail for Nail?
That seems to be the only hope for this team right now. From the ownership, to the front office, to the coaches, on down to the players. Everything is in disarray right now. At this point, I don’t believe a coaching change would make much of a difference. This team needs wholesale changes.
by jbcanesfan26 on Nov 26, 2011 2:02 AM EST via mobile reply actions
Trades won't do much
A coaching change that results in a radically different attitude might work; it would at least make the team more interesting. Bring up an entire line from Charlotte, platoon EVERYONE, work smarter not harder. Some details in my fanpost.
No, changing the coach and doing the same old thing wouldn’t help much.
Remember Mo's formula for success?
1) play with 100% battling effort for 60 minutes. Hmmm, not this game.
2) goalie must outplay other team’s goalie. I don’t blame Cam for this loss, OTOH he didn’t outplay the opposition.
3) offensive difference-maker(s) must make a difference. Stall, no. Skinner, not quite.
So it’s hardly surprising we lost, what may be surprising is we only lost by 1 goal (really…). Then again, at home, to one of the worst teams in the league…
Mo Must Go.
heads shold roll
starting with JR! i’m the biggest “Mo Must Go” guy, but JR needs to be shown the door as well. 1) for bringing Mo back…2) for continuing the Mo experiment…3) for putting this abortion of a team on the ice this season, tell us it’s a playoff contender, and keep doing it.
sorry, these players flat out suck! (exception, skinner, sutter, and cam)…this coach flat out sucks! this organization flat out sucks! we won the stanley cup in ’06 and have seen the playoffs ONCE since then?
JR should be the first shown the door and should be told to take his boy toy, MO, with him. i’m sick of watching this crap! don’t give me money issues either! there’s enough to put a winner on the ice here. and if you do that, more people will show up and spend more money! I’ve been a STH for 8 yrs now! I WILL NO LONGER SPEND MY HARD EARNED MONEY ON THIS CRAP! why sould i? they obviously don’t care about providing us an entertaining team!
if PK doesn’t sack up and get rid of this entire joke of a front office and coach he might as well move the team out of town! F him!, F jr, F Mo! F ’em all!
Man…that was pretty direct and to the point for a 7AM comment. In principle, I agree with everything you said about the organization failing to put a winner on the ice. I too, refuse to buy into the notion that we should merely appreciate the fact that we have hockey in our city and accept a garbage team that makes garbage decisions from the top down. The NHL is built on fan bases that can fill a 17 to 20K seat facility, and will support the team with corporate sponsorships. Raleigh has plenty of upside potential in all of those areas if you offer a winning product on the ice.
It is now the responsibility of the business to change public perception about the product since it is so clearly failing, at least perceptually if not profitably. Something has to happen.
"Forget about style; worry about results."
Bobby Orr
One of the things I find most confusing about this organization is the players that JR gets while knowing the tendencies of his coach. Why have small quick players on a team that plays defense first? JR and MO are a horrible combination that don’t seem to be on the same page or realistic about their abilities. Either get defensive players or get an offensive coach. Otherwise you get what we have now. If Mo isn’t the one to go, JR should be. JR’s move to improve the defense? Trade away a serviceable Corvo for an overpriced Kaberle. Players look good in Boston because of the system, not because they are good or in their prime. Didn’t we learn that with the return of Aaron Ward? Once a good player, but never fit in down here again once he went to Boston.
And how can we be successful on the power play when our five on five offensive scheme is to shoot the puck on the rush before we get to the top of the circles and then skate back on defense? No wonder we can’t control the puck on the powerplay.
I am wondering more and more about the desire of ownership to keep the team in Raleigh, especially after the quick sale and leave of Atlanta. But at this point the person in charge of production on the ice verse cost is JR, and I can not believe that his production team is meeting goals. Edwards Mill needs to keep repeating, “It is nothing personal, its just business.”
I've been thinking the same thing regarding coach and GM
they just aren’t on the same page. and you can’t win if the coach and GM aren’t on the same page
Heel for school, Vol for life!
Bolts, Preds, Canes (childhood team, home state team, hometown team). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity!
by Incipient_Senescence on Nov 26, 2011 10:21 AM EST up reply actions
Last night on 99.9
I called in, used my real name, Frank, and asked John F and Mike “What’s the definition of insanity?”
That is what is going on now. The team is on their heels, not on they’re toes. They’re reacting, not setting the tone. They seem to be looking to get into a position on the ice (right now it seems to be “bent over”) rather than staying mobile to handle whatever is going on
I think the players are pretty set. Yeah, there are a few but I will place the blame where it belongs, on the coach. Stewart is chronically under used. The whole team seems to be more aware of being out of “position based on the system” rather than playing what I think the Canes actually are; a fast team where offense is the best defense
I agree with your comments. They are brief but right to the point.
by FoxtrotSierra on Nov 26, 2011 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Time to see the kids
Taking some of the emotion out of it; Since we are clearly not a playoff team, I’d like to see the organization make a decision to see what we have in our best prospects for the rest of this season.
I’m perfectly happy with a true “rebuilding” season vs. trying to piece this together with our current roster only to fight our way to 9th. Let’s see what we have in Boychuk, Bowman, Dalpe, Samson. Dump some salary for picks and let the kids play.
If we could do this with new leadership…even better.
Wouldn’t it be alot better to lose to Winnipeg at home if we knew we were building something?
This fan is just as disappointed as many
of you are and were when the canes went 0-14 not all that long ago…If you were the GM who would you keep ? My List would be: Staal,Skimmer,Ward,Sutter16,Faulk,Harrison,Gleason,Allen,Ruutu,The Juice,Tlusty,Pitts,Dwyer,Boucher
My list I’d get rid of/trade,buy out would be: Kabs,Stewart,Poni,LaRose,McBain,
the rest like Brent,Joslin and other players i may have missed would have to work hard like Skinner and Brindy did & do to get & keep that “edge” and the team as a whole make it to .600 and at a min.stay there for the balance of the season…but when we go and trade or dump players we also have to be ever mindful of just what is out there and who is more or better than decent in the AHL to assist in the all but total rebuild of the canes…but as a fan…would even this be enough or possibly too much ? in defence of the game/sport it is really easy to be in the seats and pitch fits and etc…but if many of us here actually had the respsondsibility if being a GM would/may see or do things differently…after all …what do i know…I’m just a fan…have a good day gang…
9/11/01 - Never Forget !!
Long Live #63 The Condor
Go Canes & Checkers !!!
Hello, Dr. Jim Rutherford, It is Time for You to Operate; Your Patient in Ready
It is time. Jim Rutherford needs to conduct some relatively significant surgery without blowing up the team. As I looked at the pre-season, I thought this season was all about (1) a wing for Staal and (2) the power play. The power play is 29th out of 30 with a 12.2% scoring ratio. Staal is floundering in the worst slump of his career. I would keep:
I too would keep Staal, Skinner, Sutter16, Faulk, Harrison, Allen, Ruutu, Jokinen, Tlusty, Pitkanen, Boucher. I’d also keep McBain, Brent, Stewart and Joslin. I am borderline on Ponikarovsky and would be inclined to keep him. Dwyer is a player I would not regret Rutherford keeping because he is so fast and heady. If Dwyer had even average NHL hands, he’d be a 20 goal scorer because he is such a fast, excellent skater. His defense is superb. I can see arguments to keep him and arguments to go for a bigger, stronger, angrier player to file his slot or a more skilled player.
I would trade: Kaberle (waive him and put him in the AHL if necessary if he does not clear); Gleason, and LaRose. Gleason should return an excellent draft choice and perhaps a prospect. LaRose probably would not yield that much in draft picks, but I don’t see him being anything more than a third line wing; and feel the Hurricanes will have better choices available for the role he best serves. Kaberle is nothing short of a disaster.
The 2012 draft is going to rival the 2003 draft. The Hurricanes have Faulk who is doing excellently. McBain is having a rough year; but I would not give up on him. Murphy is going to be excellent as well.
The glaring weakness is putting together a first line or more specifically a line with Staal. Skinner/Ruutu/Jokinen are fine as a first line. It isn’t the fastest line in the NHL, but they are a threat to score on every shift they take. Staal is so busy pouting and being frustrated with himself that he is highly ineffective.
It’s time to put out on the ice a younger product and a product where the more skilled players like Dalpe and Boychuk are put in the top six. It cannot be any worse than the results we’ve seen thus far. I do think a player like Turris (who may be available since he has re-signed with Phoenix) needs to be added. Add one of the top four forwards in the 2012 draft and with the emergence of Victor Rask, Dalpe, and Boychuk, and perhaps Bowman, the Hurricanes will be fine at forward.
Good points. Only disagreement would be send McBain anywhere. He is not an NHL defenseman.
by FoxtrotSierra on Nov 26, 2011 10:15 AM EST up reply actions
Last season, he had the same problems. All I heard was “oh, he will work out over the summer and gain strength and some speed.” Yeah, I’m sure he did.
I honestly think part of the problem is his lack of confidence to just play and react
why he was scratched at the beginning of the seaon is a mystery to me…hardly seems the way to build confidence of a young defenseman that in many ways exceeded expectations for his 1st full season in the NHL last year. The way he was handled by this organization, I am not at all surprised to see him regress!
JR must go
this entire season is 100% on him at this point. A real GM would’ve beaten the bushes for a real winger for Staal in the preseason, using any of the 7-8 terrific prospects we have in Charlotte as bargaining chips. He also would’ve canned Mo after his first losing streak, when it was clear the team had no direction. Now, after changing the forechecking system yet again (one forward in, the rest in defensive position) to cut down on goals against, we are sorely lacking in offense. Our PP continues to stink — this is all on Mo from a system standpoint, and on the 2/3 of the players on the roster who are giving half-hearted efforts on the ice (I’m talking to you, Staal).
All that said, this garbage we have to root for was put together by JR, and he should bear the blunt of the criticism.
JR must go.
Of Maurice, Karmanos said: "I’m happy Paul is back but he’s going to be judged the same way as any other coach. We need to win more consistently."
by Sergeant Stinky on Nov 26, 2011 8:46 AM EST reply actions
Fire Stormy and Ron the Ref too
In the Battle of the Titans of the Southeast conference the ex-Thrashers eeked out a hard fought victory against the Canes. The loss moved the Canes ever closer to the trophy they seek this year. After the loss Mo said “we need to tweek the offense and defense a bit more”. He pointed out that their are 4 teams in the west as well as the Islanders in the east ahead of us in the raise for the trophy. Mo added “I like the effort. More of this will get us to the tees and draft table first this summer. I especially like the way we are getting the PP to look Just like our PK.”
Where do we go from here?
So the issues are many and deep. What is next? Well, you cannot fire the team. The problems as I see it are mostly coaching issues. There seems to be few teams willing to deal. The only choice is to change coaches. If Maurice is out, who will they go to? I have to believe Jeff Daniels is the obvious choice. His team is in first place using the same guys that Maurice has failed with. He knows the Kids and knows the Vets. He is clearly a teacher and a student of the game. He is an organizational guy. The only downside is this is a really bad situation to put a coach into. I think he can get it done though. Dave Lewis is not the choice as he seems part of the problem now. Even if he is guilty by association. While Brindy may make a good coach in the future, he is not ready to take an NHL team. So they likely will go to Jeff Daniels. So the new coach is in the system.
What about the players? There is clearly a hole on the top line. Stewart was a beast last night. He is so hard to move off the puck. He is the missing piece. He is a player and needs time on the top line. That move alone should fix the Staal production issue. Winnepeg was double teaming Staal all night. There needs to be two threats along side Eric to free up space for him. Case in point, Staal, Stillman and Cole. All three were threats in their own right. There are some good players in Charlotte otherwise they would not be in first place. Right now, the Canes are getting NO respect…zero. The other teams can and will shut them down over and over until a change happens and they can establish a top line. That will never happen if that line is not put together and kept together for a period of time. So the players are in the system.
So lets talk about JR for a moment. I am a big JR fan. He has gotten more from less than any other GM in my opinion. In my mind, he has made only two mistakes. One was letting Malik go a few years ago after developing him(painfully so). The second one and a more glaring one is Erik Cole. He develops this guy into an impact pro, then will not match Montreal’s offer? Worse, he thinks one of the Young guys will fill that spot then allows Maurice to make that call? To top that off, he signs Kaberle for 4 million per season when we have too many defensemen already? Could not give that money to one of your core guys a man that broke his neck(literally) in your sweater? There is something more that we all don’t know there because it is not logical. Karmanos is an issue as well. He decides that he doesn’t like Laviolette so franchise be damned, fire him. Maurice can run his team into the ground and doesn’t irritate him so he stays but Laviolette(not a yes man) gets out of line and he sees the door. That guy is a great coach. Like Scotty Bowman, just win baby, just win.
So, Mo will go, Jeff will arrive, players will be positioned correctly, the team will play much better, Jeff Daniels will run a tight ship and I hope all this will be fixed. Its a lot of pressure on a young coach but he can do it. At least the decision to give him a shot will not be Maurices.
here here
However, all things being equal and normal around here…..we will still not get any action on a change until the first if the week. With a charter booked and players arriving early at the RBC for, hopefully a bag skate, followed by a 2pm flight (saw It on the board behind Staal along with the not filled out Eastern Conference standings hmmmm), no press conference or decision will be made. I am not even betting on anything this week. I am expecting a whole lot of silence from Edwards Mill. Oh well
"Forget about style; worry about results."
Bobby Orr
by Caniac233 on Nov 26, 2011 9:51 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
To your fine JR list I would add the recent Ray Whitney debacle.
I could roll with not resigning Cole IF JR had gone out and found a top-6 winger to replace him. Poni and Stewart were clearly not that guy , just more bargain shopping. And it would have been a nice slap-in-the-face to Cole if they had given his Montreal money to another winger.
by drifterscape on Nov 26, 2011 11:47 AM EST up reply actions
That has to be the worst game Eric Staal has played. Did he eve make any pass that went to one of his own players? Disgraceful. As for Kaberle, what a joke.
Rutherford, are you still sitting on your hands or are you going to do something? If I was in charge, you would be gone as well for failing so miserably doing your job. You have watched for 3 weeks as this debacle has slowly unfolded.
We sat and watched two of the worst teams in the Eastern Conference last night. I can’t remember seeing a Canes team so lacking in terms of upper echelon talent and devoid of ideas as this one.
I wanted to do a more of a this was positive and this was a negative thing. The volumes of negative are far too vast however. Then it dawned on me. Maybe we are seeing the results of circumstance. Like shit coaching, a GM that screwed the pooch, an owner that just won’t spend that extra nickel to get to the next level. So lemme run down a few things and see what ya’ll think.
Eric Staal- I saw last night my most hated aspect of Staals game. He and one of our others guys got knocked down in the corner. Other dude gets up, Staal has arms up and is rolling over….other guy looks back to make sure Staal is OK he is still n his ass with arms up, other guy is across the blueline as Staal starts getting to his feet. He has very little seming interest in bringing the puck into the O zone or he has lost that skill. The guy can’t finish, his scoring this year is below pathetic and see zero leadership from him. In last nights game I did see a couple super sweet feeds, but that was all and not what is expected from him.
Coach Mo- Against an almost as pathetic team he couldn’t find a plan or a line for one goal with our team that has enough skill to shit at least one clutch goal. Hard as I try I can’t come up with anything positive he did.
I kinda had a wild idea, but put it in your pipe and smoke it for a tad. I’ve been hearing Coach Babcock may be on the outs with Detroit. He would be perfect to clean house and develop the one major asset, Skinner. The Detroit org. is what PK and JR have been tryin for, but only shop at the dollar store. Babs is great with youg talent, knows how it’s supposed to work and sign him for the rest of this year and nxt with the understanding it’s gonna be all. It bys te Canes a guy that can do the job through next year and gives Babs a year to find a team. Maybe we find eachother.
If we don’t get Staal going or trade him this team will never be a PO team. Skinner is already everthing and more than Staal is or was. There are also sevral parts in thye works that need a true chance to shine, not 4 minutes a night. McBain is a good example. I have seen him play a brilliant game, also seen him play like he was snorting ‘ludes. Let’s see where he really is in a fair manner, not under Mo psychotic hand.
While not written in stone and I really ain’t trying to pile on Staal, things have to change and sooner rather than later. I see flashes of brillian high levels of skill and it seems that is rewarded with a stint on the 4th line and 4 minutes of play. I saw LaRose…Chad LaRose get the number one slot in the shoot out last night. Men are from Mars, Women are from Venus and Mo’s out of his frickin mind.
My interest as a fan has been diminished to the point of not even DVR’ng th games anymore. If there is a shake up I’ll come back. But these are hours of my life I will never get back and are filled with false hopes and shattered dreams. The Canes are not giving the fans what they deserve or the players.
Off soap box.
A
Getting old sucks!
You are entitled to your views and they are all justified. My only suggestion is let’s dump Mo FIRST. Then let’s get a new appraisal of our players. Then those players found lacking we also dump for whatever we can get for them, even if it is nothing.
by FoxtrotSierra on Nov 26, 2011 10:23 AM EST up reply actions
Yes,
The problem with “fixing” everything at the same time makes it impossible to really know what it broken
When I find that I can’t reach a network device, if I were to “fix everything”, change the power connections, replace the device, replace the connecting switches and routers, replace the cables and patch panels, what really was broken?
One thing at a time, either fire Mo or tell him to burn out his “big book of 1995 NJ defense” and let his team skate
Right now, I doubt if Mo can fix his game and style
THE TIME FOR CHANGE IS NOW!!!!
Fire Paul, bring in Jeff Daniels. Take the C of Staal and wait till next year and give it to someone else. Put Kaberle on waivers and trade LaRose, Gleason, McBain, and Poni for some real talent. And cut Staal’s ice time back significantly.
I think all of us STH should go to the RBC Center when PK is there and tell him what a cheap-ass he really is and to start spending some money on this team.
by skinnerthewinner on Nov 26, 2011 10:18 AM EST reply actions
I think it’s pretty obvious the team is going to stay in this state of limbo until JR grows some cajones and does something.
How many weeks ago did he say he was trying to do something? Didn’t he say that he would look at a coaching change if they lost a bunch of games? Well, where are these changes JR? You created the mess on the ice, you fix it. You signed Kaberle, you get rid of him. Kaberle and McBain probably account for half of our goals against. Even if the offense is stagnant, they single-highhandedly lost both this game and the Montreal game with their terrible play. McBain with his terrible pinches and inability to play defense, Kaberle with his lack of strength and speed. Both of them are terrible defensemen and deserve to be on the next bus out of Raleigh. Why play them when we have a competent defenseman in the press box and promising talent in Charlotte?
And as for you, Maurice, you are just a complete idiot. 2 of the 3 goals in the Montreal game came directly from us fore-checking aggressively with 2 or 3 men. 2 of the 4 goals in the Philly game came from an aggressive fore-check. 1 of the 3 goals in the Toronto game came from an aggressive fore-check. So what is the logical thing to do? NOT TO STOP THE FORECHECK! Your idea that “a good offense is a good defense” only works if the said defense is good. Our defense isn’t good. It sucks frankly. In our case, it is much more accurate to say “a good defense is a good offense.” For our defense to play well, we need our forwards to come back and help out. We need them to play the half-boards and the points well while the two defensemen stay down low to clear pucks and bodies out. In the offensive zone, we need them to pressure their defense to keep the puck from moving out of the zone smoothly.
TSN said it perfectly in the 4-0 debacle in Montreal when they said that Carolina is an example of a systematic failure. With his job on the line, it appeared that Maurice loosened the reins slightly and let the offense play more aggressive. The players were also motivated to help him keep his job. Now Maurice’s job seems to be slightly secure again and the players have clearly lost that motivation. Worse, Maurice has regressed to the exact same playstyle that led to his job being in jeopardy in the first place, and once again, it doesn’t work! The guy is too stubborn for his job and he needs to go now.
Take JR with you, Mo.
Couldn’t have said it better. I’d give JR a reprieve for now though.
by FoxtrotSierra on Nov 26, 2011 10:26 AM EST up reply actions
Ability to make basic hockey plays last night
might’ve been the worst I’ve ever seen. Passes were off target much more often than on, stick-handling was a disaster, and I can’t count how many shots didn’t come within three feet of the net (including at least two in which the net was pretty well empty). I was bringing my family to their first hockey game, and they even noticed it. My sister never watches any sports at all, and she asked me if she’d had unrealistic expectations to come in thinking they’d be fairly good with stickwork and the like. The ability to play fundamentals was just embarrassing.
Props to Tlusty and Sutter. I think those are the only two who care anymore.
I’m not sure whether the solution is a new coach or a new GM, but I am sure of one thing: the solution is a coach and GM who have the same system in mind. JR’s players (unskilled as many of them may be) just don’t fit in Mo’s system.
Heel for school, Vol for life!
Bolts, Preds, Canes (childhood team, home state team, hometown team). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity!
by Incipient_Senescence on Nov 26, 2011 10:26 AM EST reply actions
????
Canes fan in Southern California and I’m hearing rumors of the Ducks (also struggling underachieving team) on verge of making a huge trade involving one of their big guns. Getzlaf? Perry? Ryan?? Out of the 3 I think it would be Getzlaf. He’s having a Staal-like season and pouting. Along with his poor production making stupid plays on the ice, giving away the puck (again Staal-like) and flat out frustrated. Changes are need BIGTIME for both teams. Hmmm..wonder if the talks are with the Canes!!
To go along with who to keep and who needs to go? I’d keep : Ward, Skinner, Sutter and Faulk. The rest of the team should seriously be restless right now, having trouble sleeping at night and seriously consider if they are NHL caliber players. Some might not even make it in the ECHL. Some should be just shown the door, Pointing at you Kaberle. Getting b*tch slapped by Ladd and then missing a wide open gaping net!! Dude, you suck. My 96 year old grandpa burries that. Everyone knows you keep your stick on the ice and just guide the puck in on a pass like that, not try to wrist it?? WTF!!! Nice flub you pile. It’s disgusting paying for Center Ice to watch this terrible horse*hit team play. I wonder if there is still time for a refund.
by whalecanes@s... on Nov 26, 2011 10:43 AM EST reply actions
Make a Trade AFTER Mo is Gone
Don’t give him more life support.
Why do we need another player that gives up?
Who knows where Staal’s head is. Gleason and Ruu are obviously not playing for a new contract. Juice appears to have given up. Kaberle was a bust. I can’t see Poni and Stewart long enough to make a judgement. LaRose is overslotted. The ghost first line winger is still missing.
Sutter and Skinner can’t carry this team. My fear is they are on the cusp of giving up.
No. We need a new coach FIRST. Let him evaluate our gaps. I don’t need yet another JR bumbling just so his buddy can keep his job a few more games.
It's A Drop In Skill Level
What’s ailing the Canes? First, it’s poor coaching. 2nd, it’s a drop off in the skill level of the players. The core of this team used to be Whitney, Brindamoor, Cullen, Stillman, Hedican, Wesley, Cole, etc. and when we needed help we got Rechhi and Weight. None of these players were super fast (exception being Cole), none had a booming shot, none were big bangers. The thing they all had in common was they were extremely well skilled hockey players who knew how to play the game. We have not replaced these players with players who have the same skill levels (exceptions are Jokinen and Pitkanen). We replaced Ladd with Ruutu which was at least a breakeven (although I prefer Ruutu).
I got this thought from my buddy Curt last night. He was commenting to me on the lack of skill (passing, shooting accuracy, positioning, intensity, etc.). Seems to me my buddy is onto something.
where are the mo apologists?
There are probably having brunch with ice chip
"Forget about style; worry about results."
Bobby Orr
by Caniac233 on Nov 26, 2011 11:26 AM EST via iPhone app reply actions
I think they all fled the site & the building !!
9/11/01 - Never Forget !!
Long Live #63 The Condor
Go Canes & Checkers !!!
by CaniacSteve on Nov 26, 2011 11:34 AM EST up reply actions
No Announcement Today?
Guess Mo will get to board the plane again. Dammit.
More time wasted.
I check twitter every day hoping i see the coaching change. My patience is wearing thin. If changes are not made asap, i will walk away as a STH next year.
by sunshine12 on Nov 26, 2011 12:46 PM EST via mobile reply actions
I think my parents are in the same boat...
They’ve been pretty disappointed with the ’Canes this year too.
Ready for the Canes to win the Cup again! :)
they are on the plane
No coaching change today. Maybe mo is catching a ride to be dropped off in Ontario.
"Forget about style; worry about results."
Bobby Orr
by Caniac233 on Nov 26, 2011 2:41 PM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
WTF?
I can’t believe they let him on the damn plane. This is way past being old.
No game on Monday. Fix the problem. That will be 25 games in. Assuming we win…that will make us 9-12-4……worse than Lavi’s 12-11-2 record when he was fired. I want to see some equity here.
The right decision.
Looks like I made the right decision in not keeping my STH status this year after five years. It sure is nice not to have that 2 1/2 hour drive home to think about how awful this hockey club is. Now I only have to turn off the TV. Something needs to happen drastically with the front office or there are going to be plenty more fans on the mass exodus. I love this team and bleed black and red but come on have some pride in your game Staal! I have to be on the MO MUST GO bandwagon.
by wmartin146 on Nov 26, 2011 2:12 PM EST via iPhone app reply actions
If a loss tomorrow helps secure Mo being sent out of Raleigh then tomorrow Im going to be one of the Sens biggest fans.
by bready86 on Nov 26, 2011 3:29 PM EST via mobile reply actions
So I haven’t looked at attendance figures but it looks like attendance is on a decline this year. 15,718 for a Friday night game over a holiday against a division rival in the form of a new team?
There is obvious discontent amongst fans, from the “Mo Must Go” chants to the extremely pissed off faithful fans yelling obscenities at the team every 2 minutes. Even little kids are getting annoyed.
I felt a little bit alone booing in section 325 last night. I am sure Bob and/or Brian could here us and the section 328 rabble rousers who chanted Mo Must Go all the way down the escalators. Perhaps it is a little rude, but I think it has its appropriate place in Hockey culture. I grew up believing that booing was a bit classless and unsportsmanlike, but I can see that fan feedback, even in the form of booing has it’s proper place. After all, it is not like the Carolina Hurricanes organization send us customer feedback surveys that relate to team performance or coaching status. I support more fans letting them have it when they give poor efforts like last night. Hopefully someone on the club reads these posts.
"Forget about style; worry about results."
Bobby Orr
Another day of no changes
I have some patience. I am a realist. I know things don’t change overnight but what the hell are we waiting for??? I check the net everday waiting for something to happen but nothing, nada, zilch… Clearly this roster in this structure isn’t working. It doesnt take a genius to eork out that trades or coaching changes need to occur. Hell, I’d be happy if they even brought in a new water boy. Give me something to pin some hope to… I am faithful and won’t stop supporting this franchise but I am really having some trouble with the way the front office is just standing by while everything unravels. Make a move!!! It’s way to early in the year to just stand by.
by OzzyCane on Nov 26, 2011 9:41 PM EST via mobile reply actions
OK..haven't seen the last two games...
Read all I could. My take, which obivously jives with the rest of this board:
Mo is the problem. As i commented during his winning streak, he relaxed his defense first mentality, let the forwards play their game more with skating and passing. We looked more relaxed, played the full sixty minutes, and looked good. Then we hear Mo say we need to get our offense form defense???? Back to the battle and grind mentality, one forechecker, a high forward…..i.e the system no one on this teams seems to want to play and buy into. So what do we see? Less effort, not 60 minutes, less team buy in, same crappy results we got when Mo wanted this before.
The we got line issues. Mo puts Skins and Finns together—finally—again and they go off and start scoring. Mo breaks them apart, Skinner and Ruu go missing. Skinner makes one good personal play to score, but we broke the only consistent offensive threat line we had. We still see Sutter and Tlusty getting it done on the third line, scoring at a third line rate no matter who the third wheel is. We see the 4th line scoring and Stewart probaly scoring at the best rate per minut eon the team, yet these guys are buried. Any other coahc with brain and vision would put Skins and Finns back together and play it as the top line—hello?
Sutter and Dwyer have been consistent no matter who’s on the line, so the worry is the second line. Start with Staal (and second line only TOI 18 minutes max) put him with Poni again, and try Stewart, or LaRose, Or whomever-but Leave Skins and Finns—it works stop changing it. Keep changing Staal until he clicks or the other members of his line click. Then play the 4th line. They are playing and scoring like a decent 4th line on any NHL team—why sit them??
PP still sucks, poor personnel, poor system….
Yes we lack key players, but it’s coaching that keeps putting McBain and Kaberle out again and again when we have Joslin waiting in the wings. At least give him some time, he’s no worse than the two I mentioned and he may well continue to develop or findhis form from last year when he played…
bad Coaching. Bad, Bad, Bad.
JR is OK, Mo not
JR put together a team and coaches that won the Cup. Yes, he’s gambled and lost (Kabs). He hasn’t been willing to risk quite enough (Cullen, Ward after winning the cup). Yes he’s hampered by the budget (Whitney, Cole for FOUR years). He’s also made some great pickups (Samsonov for a while, Jokinen, Recchi and Weight in the Cup year). Who do you think could do better?
Seriously, how many small market teams win the Cup? We’ve been pretty lucky in that respect.
But he hasn’t fired a coach who isn’t appropriate for our players and our prospects. Is that his fault, or does it go all the way up to PK? The same PK who badmouthed the coach who won the Cup? Maybe more of this is PK’s fault than some think. And there isn’t a way to get rid of PK unless some of you have a ton of money stashed away to buy the team.
Btw, at the start of the season some thought we should give Mo about a third of the season and then decide whether he should stay. 27 games will be one third. We’ll need to be +4 in win/loss to be on pace to make the playoffs. We’re -4 after 24 games, cannot get to better than -1.
Time to fire the coach.
(Wasn’t McBain a better player last year? What happened?)
McBain was a better player and ended up with 30 pts, which I thought was pretty good for a young offensive-d. The D corps has been a mess all season. Spending the money better used elsewhere for Kaberle, dressing 9(8?) d at the beginning of the season. I dunno if having a glut of D could be affecting their psyches, as in “you’re expendable” mindsets. Things just feel disjointed and unorganized to me, like JR is without a plan.
when mcbain came up he was fire for his first 20-30 games
by Cincinnati Reds on Nov 27, 2011 5:15 AM EST reply actions
I would change everyone behind the bench. Its not just Mo, I would argue the D coaching is not quite up to snuff as well. McBain has talent but he’s young which means there needs to be good coaching to get the most out of this Dman, it doesn’t look like we’ve got what he needs.
by playwithpride on Nov 27, 2011 10:25 AM EST up reply actions
Horrible goal difference
I see that we have the second worst goal difference in the league (-22, -23 for Anaheim). I’ve never noticed for hockey, but in soccer the teams at the bottom of the standings tend to have the worst GD, and the ones at the top have the best. Yet another indication that we have one of the worst teams in the league, with this coach.
Goals Against; Versus Goals For
Since Maurice announced his “defense first” approach, I haven’t noticed much difference in the number of shots allowed or an increase in the number of losses. I tend to think Maurice was not announcing he was reverting to a New Jersey Devil style of play; and I think his choice of words was unfortunate for him. My take is that any sane coach would want his team as committed to playing defense as to offense. From what I saw when playing basketball and watching endless hours of lacrosse, soccer, and now hockey, there is a tendency among some of the star athletes to be slightly more relaxed on defense because they are consumed with the need to score goals. I didn’t like how Maurice phrased his so-called new approach; but if his point was even the stars had to get greasy and dirty then it’s nothing radical.
Maurice’s style is not to call out players. I suspect we’d be seeing a significantly different approach under a coach such as Tortorella (who I find somewhat entertaining as long as he is not coaching the Hurricanes). I expect Tortorella would explain the Hurricanes #26 standing in the NHL and #29 in the NHL for the power play as: “(1) our power play couldn’t score in the warm-ups with an empty net; (2) Staal is MIA; (3) Kaberle is still asleep some place in Toronto; (4) we have to play LaRose in the top six, enough said there; and (5) our defense has a bad tendency to give up goals in bunches by committee, otherwise we are having a very forgettable season thus far.”
Maurice has to invent new ways not to say the obvious without throwing any players under the bus. It’s an almost impossible task. Given Maurice’s reluctance in using players who have not completely and totally earned his trust, he’s in a mess. He’d probably be facing losing his job anyway he dealt with the situation; but his style makes much more of a target for disdain and lack of confidence in his coaching skills. He’s not exactly Mr. Charisma even though he has a great sense of humor.
I agree. It’s kind of ironic how he is trying to build a def. ike the devils without parts. Lets say Ward is as goodas Marty. Gleason hs pretty much took a dump so is our Rafalski? They had a nasty sob as captin, who is our Stevens? It’s like he’s trying to make a silk purse from a pigs ear. This team in no way shape or form can shut down a game with a one goal lead. They are lucky they ca shut the john door to take a crap.
my not even close to humble opinion is this is more in line with a say Detroit style. Staal had HAD only one skill when he was motivated. He could score or at least get the pck on net for somebody else to sweep in the garbage. Skinner looks to be a far more rounded player. Skinner is very similar to Datsyuk, I guess for purpose ould be a limited Zetterburg. While everybody in the league would like a Holmstrom, maybe with some help we could get a Ruutu to get ugly in the crease. I dunno.
Bottom line this team is a dollar store version of that and they need 3 goals or better each night to give Ward a shot at stealing one. We are not skilled enough on D and the only guy we have that can singl handedly come back against a rush, steal a puck and turn it around seems to be Sutter, though Skinner seems to be coming along.
Mo is beating a square peg into a board with no hole at all. He’s trying to force something that just isn’t possible. I find it even more disturbing JR et al ar allowing it to continue.
A
Getting old sucks!
Jim Rutherford's Approach
No GM is right 100% of the time; and Jim Rutherford cannot be expected to be perfect in his decision-making. Maurice was a huge risk. Unless there is a miracle ending fit for a feature film Maurice is not going to make it beyond this season. Jim Rutherford keeps all kinds of ideas bouncing around in his head according to everybody I’ve heard or read or to whom I’ve spoken. He does not rush to judgment; and as a person who makes quick decisions, it does frankly seem like an eternity for the ultimate decision to be made.
It’s the same holes many people forecast: (1) Cole’s departure was going to take some good luck in finding a replacement; (2) the power play had to improve; (3) Kaberle’s signing was either going to be a stroke of genius or a full cargo ship packed full of fail. Staal has done Maurice no favors by putting on one of the worst starts imaginable. Gleason is amazingly up and down this season; and when he’s on his game, he’s nearly an elite defenseman. Other times, he seems out of sync; and he acts like a person having some back issues from having seen people with back issues up close and personal. One day they are dancing on top of the world; other days, they couldn’t out run a turtle.
The Detroit model means the Hurricanes have to grow in-house some more puck possession talent with a touch more physicality. Detroit isn’t Philadelphia in terms of the mean factor, but Detroit is quietly physical. The lack of size of the Hurricanes is not helping the situation at all. It is unlike Rutherford to trade LaRose or Dwyer; but they really are dubious beyond the fourth line in a Detroit system. As others have pointed out, having both LaRose and Dwyer creates problems in matching up for a puck possession team.
It’s going to take players like Dalpe, Rask, Boychuk, and Bowman demonstrating without any shadow of a doubt that they deserve top nine minutes and to do so at a level that literally nobody could dispute it. All benefit of rationalization, all weight of judgment will favor LaRose and Dwyer because that is how Jim Rutherford tends to approach these difficult questions. He weighs loyalty significantly; but in the end, there is always room for a player like Skinner.
If I am right about Rutherford’s approach, he will give Maurice every possible chance to succeed. I believe, although on this issue I could well be wrong, that Jim Rutherford will wait until the season ends to assess Maurice. There is about a 10% chance, however, Jim Rutherford will fire Maurice within the next two weeks and if so, I’m guessing Daniels will be elevated to head coach. I agree that Maurice’s fatal flaws include his unshakable belief in his own ability to will round pegs into square holes. To my observations, he seems to be the walking definition of perseveration. See below:
perseveration
Also found in: Medical, Encyclopedia, Wikipedia 0.01 sec.
per·sev·er·a·tion (pr-sv-rshn)
n.
1. Psychology
a. Uncontrollable repetition of a particular response, such as a word, phrase, or gesture, despite the absence or cessation of a stimulus, usually caused by brain injury or other organic disorder.
b. The tendency to continue or repeat an act or activity after the cessation of the original stimulus.
2. The act or an instance of persevering; perseverance.
The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition copyright ©2000 by Houghton Mifflin Company. Updated in 2009. Published by Houghton Mifflin Company. All rights reserved.
perseveration [pɜːˌsɛvəˈreɪʃən]
n Psychol
1. (Psychology) the tendency for an impression, idea, or feeling to dissipate only slowly and to recur during subsequent experiences
2. (Psychology) an inability to change one’s method of working when transferred from one task to another
Collins English Dictionary – Complete and Unabridged © HarperCollins Publishers 1991, 1994, 1998, 2000, 2003
perseveration – The recurrence of a tune or thought in the mind.
See also related terms for tune.
Farlex Trivia Dictionary. © 2011 Farlex, Inc. All rights reserved.
ThesaurusLegend: Synonyms Related Words Antonyms
Noun 1. perseveration – the tendency for a memory or idea to persist or recur without any apparent stimulus for it
inclination, tendency, disposition – an attitude of mind especially one that favors one alternative over others; “he had an inclination to give up too easily”; “a tendency to be too strict”
2. perseveration – the act of persisting or persevering; continuing or repeating behavior; “his perseveration continued to the point where it was no longer appropriate”
perseverance, persistence
Is it PM or JR?
It has been tentatively suggested on this blog that Mo may just be a loyal soldier and JR is really heavily influencing player slotting and lines, etc. Your comment, ‘All benefit of rationalization, all weight of judgment will favor LaRose and Dwyer because that is how Jim Rutherford tends to approach these difficult questions’ seems to be a direct statement that Mo is, for the most part, doing what he’s told to do. And JR is just following PK’s lead, too.
That would explain the visceral vitriol of the organization towards Peter Laviolette. Lavi is creative and unafraid to alter his system to fit his players and put them in a position to succeed. It never made any sense that he was fired for the exit interview thing other than as a straw that broke the camel’s back. Simply put, Lavi is reasonably independent and JR and PK may not have been able to tolerate that.
Another perspective on Mo not throwing anyone under the bus is that he would by inference, if not directly, wind up throwing JR under the bus. That’d lead to an immediate exit as, IMO, JR seems to take things quite personally that should be looked at more distantly with greater overall perspective.
The problem then is where to go from here. While Jeff Daniels is in the organiztion in Charlotte, he still has a great deal of autonomy. Is he independent and psychologically secure enough to demand reasonable freedom to be creative as the Cane’s head coach, especially with mentoring prospects? Can JR give JD enough length of leash to be effective? If not, then nothing will change no matter who the coach is. In that event, the Canes will be destined to be perennial cellar dwellers.
NE Whalers-Hartford Whalers-Carolina Hurricanes
Dougy, I agree again. I will also add to your vast definition that a wise man once said that insanity is doing the same thing over and expecting diff. results. That’s what is the root here. I think I’ll go with Einstein and say this is an excercise in insanity. If the group of cretins….err the brain trust i believe they were called, doesn’t change tactics, there is no way this epic failure will stop. There is lots of fault to spread around. I just don’t see why the whole team must be sacrificed to jump start Staals game. The Skin/Finn line works, almost every shift in every game they play together. Why break what works to try to jump start what ain’t gonna get a jump start from the Hoover Dam? Staal had, I use this past tense, scoring ability. For some reason he has never attained the level of 100 goals and has rather been on a downwar cycle. Instead of sacrificing what works in a superfolous effort, hey sit the guy, trade the guy whatever. I just see no logic to what is being done and see the developement of players that are going to play in the NHL for some team being wasted. And at a time that this team needs to be doing something.
We have all watched Gleason over the years. He has been a beacon and a leader. At times this year he looks like he has Alzheimers and Polio.
Something is drasticly wrong with the Carolina Hurricanes. To have an All Star like Staal just be a waste of human element and Gleason look like he is playing at the Mite level, it’s not just the players. It’s systemic.
I just ……I will lose all respect for this team and organization if they throw another season down the shitter. I’m not even sorry. Part of what I believe what makes NHL Hockey the greatest sport is the teams play every minute of every game to win. Every move by an org. is to better the team and not all are good (Anson Carter?). What I am witnessing is not valiant effort in good faith. It’s a travesty. It’s destroying the budding careers of several very skilled players and total ineptitude in dealing with some veteran players.
Failure top to bottom.
Oh and I just don’t get the LaRose rise to top 6 except as a glaring harbinger as to ow poorly this team is run and is playing. The guy isn’t and never will be top 6. His effort is second to none but his lack of natural skill just ain’t there.
A
Getting old sucks!
Maurice versus Rutherford
sittler27 has been very articulate about the close relationship between Maurice and Rutherford. I am totally unclear if in fact Jim Rutherford is driving the bus or it is predominately Maurice. My instinct is that Maurice is getting input, but in the end Jim Rutherford is letting Maurice do his thing. Why is the more difficult question. It’s an approach that has such a low chance of success that I would have assumed as Maurice’s friend, Jim Rutherford would have stepped in with intervention.
One explanation is that there are no trades available and the consensus among the coaches is that neither Dalpe nor Boychuk are top six ready. If so, and if the Hurricanes are unwilling to trade away prospects or draft picks, then it’s a situation of making do. I obviously totally disagree with the management of the forward lines; but given the interview by Brind’Amour last night at the Checkers game, it’s definitely the “company line” that Dalpe and Boychuk need more seasoning.
Another explanation is similar. The Hurricanes need elite talent desperately and can’t afford paying for it. There could be a conscious decision that the Hurricanes will keep the status quo as far as the roster goes; and will give Dalpe, Boychuk, and Bowman more time to mature. The likely outcome, of course, is a finish anywhere from 25 to 30. In this draft, it’s like winning the lottery pick. With Rask’s development and a top 5 pick, along with Dalpe and Boychuk, the Hurricanes have some fine young forward prospects. If the Hurricanes trade away somebody like Gleason for a first round pick, it is will support the idea of a quiet rebuild.
As long as the Hurricanes pick well in the 2012 draft, they have a chance to step up into a playoff contender. I also would be surprised if Maurice has his contract extended. I am not suggesting Jim Rutherford is tossing in the towel this season; but I do think he is not going to risk the future of the organization by making some bad trades.
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