Meltdown in Manitoba: Jets 4, Hurricanes 2
by Bob Wage on Dec 10, 2011 7:01 AM EST
in Carolina Hurricanes Game Recaps
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PrintCam Ward had another tough night - and was pulled for the second time in the last three games - while the Carolina Hurricanes dropped yet another game to the Winnipeg Jets on Friday night by a score of 4-2.
Ward started off by allowing a Dustin Byfuglien goal from behind the net just 34 seconds into the game, and things did not get much better from there. The shot hit Ward from behind and somehow bounced in the net.
Less than five minutes later, Evander Kane beat Ward and before you knew it, the score was 2-0.
The Jets scored twice more in the second period, to take a commanding 4-0 lead, before Ward was finally pulled, allowing rookie Mike Murphy to take his place. The frustrated goalie was shown on television throwing a bit of a tantrum on the bench after the fact.
He finished the night allowing four goals on 30 shots, as the Jets pretty much dominated the first two periods of play.
Carolina did score twice in the third though, as Justin Faulk scored his first career NHL goal on a bouncing shot from the point and Brandon Sutter added a powerplay tally just a bit later.
The Jets would hold on to close things out though and the Hurricanes now sit that much further away from making the postseason.
The Canes close out their road trip against Toronto on Tuesday night.
Game Notes:
- Murphy played 27:29 and allowed zero goals on seven shots. He will not pick up the loss for this game though like he did in Calgary when the empty netter ended up being the game winner for the Flames.
- Carolina went 1-3 on the powerplay, but ended up allowing two powerplay tallies on the other side. Both the team's powerplay and penalty kill units are near the bottom of the league, (25th and 26th).
- Previously healthy scratched Jamie McBain had a team high 25:29 of ice time. Justin Faulk was next with 24:38. Low man again was Anthony Stewart, but he got 9:50 of ice time last night.
- The team was outshot in the opening period 19-7. For the game it was 37-25, Winnipeg. Our intern had the chances at 20-14, Jets.
- The team played a man short as Jeff Skinner was held out, reportedly because of the flu. They suited up 11 forwards and 6 defensemen.
- Eric Staal had a team high five shots on goal. He also had an assist, a minus 1 for his trouble, and won only 38% of his draws. The team went 39% for the night.
- The Canes were credited with 29 hits led by Dwyer and Nodl with five each. Tim Gleason threw down with Chris Thorburn early in the game but probably lost this decision.
Our friends at Illegal Curve have posted some post game interviews. Sutter, Spacek, and Muller
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Mull Must Go! Too soon?
www.prosportsblogging.com
by Great Ice-Pectations on Dec 10, 2011 7:30 AM EST reply actions
’Canes went tits up in this game. McBain looked awful in his own end. Jokinen? Anybody know if he still plays for us? And Cam needs to sit and figure things out.
LET'S GO CANES -- THE SEASON AIN'T OVER YET!!!
tits up?
intentional?
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Dec 10, 2011 9:58 AM EST up reply actions
I guess when the hockey gets bad this is all we have to fall back on. Winnipeg has a bit of a European flair to it and lots of pretty girls. But really guys…. have you not seen a quality pair before?
yeeeeeeaaaaaaaah
I’m pretty sure last night’s game thread was roughly equivalent to that scene in Miracle where they spend the whole game checking out the girls in the crowd. Except that the participants in last night’s game thread didn’t have to skate ’til they puked afterwards.
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Dec 10, 2011 10:04 AM EST up reply actions
Funny!
Not in a while, except the times when Muller’s head got in the way!
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 10, 2011 10:08 AM EST up reply actions
It means they died and were in their backs.
"Forget about style; worry about results."
Bobby Orr
by Caniac233 on Dec 10, 2011 11:19 AM EST via iPhone app up reply actions
Ah……let me carefully respond……
Did you see this game last night on TV?
If so , did you notice anything unusual when the camera man focused on the coach during the game?
If did not notice anything, you might be a proper young lady……
If you are not a proper young lady and still did not notice anything unusual then you might want to catch the replay of the game and pay closer attention. Some things just jump out at you…….just saying.
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 10, 2011 11:31 AM EST up reply actions
Even Tripp made a comment, which I thought was pretty funny. Something like “I can see how you can get distracted”, as the camera was focused on the Canes bench and the scenary behind.
by CanesFanFromLI on Dec 10, 2011 12:46 PM EST up reply actions
I saw this photo tweeted – for those who might have missed it and are wondering what all the fuss was about. Or if somebody wants to confirm the scene was as compelling as they remember.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 1:02 PM EST up reply actions
Dead on……however, the camera man seemed to focus on the bench way more than normal and there were a number of more compelling images. Sorta like…..“I went to Hooters and a hockey game broke out”
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 10, 2011 1:12 PM EST up reply actions
I’m not sure how early I realized that the FSN camera director was definitely going back for coach reaction far more than usual, but it was definitely before the 2nd goal. The intentions were not subtle.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 1:42 PM EST up reply actions
I guess we now know one reason why they call it the Fox Network………..
Me thinks some corrective behavior sessions occurred this morning for a few FSN on-site folks. It was a bit over the top and I remember a couple of times they were late cutting back to the live action. But hey, that is just me talking……
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 10, 2011 1:56 PM EST up reply actions
Actually, that was during the first period. By the time the third period rolled around, the scenario looked like this. This is what we were watching when Tripp made his comment.
by Jamie Kellner on Dec 10, 2011 1:26 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Yep……two fisted beer drinkers do have a tendency to slouch……posture is important ya know…….
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 10, 2011 1:34 PM EST up reply actions
the gods have blessed this young woman...ohhh the horror! the horror!!
Mi piace l'hockey su ghiaccio.
l'hockey è buono qui .. sì?
these pics remind me of a rodney carington song
" Oh it seems to me this whole world’s gone crazy
There’s too much hate and killin goin on
But when I see the bare chest of a woman
My worrys and my problems are all gone
No one thinks of fightin, when they see a topless girl
Baby if you would show yours too, we could save the world
Mi piace l'hockey su ghiaccio.
l'hockey è buono qui .. sì?
Canes play their final game in Winnipeg March 18th. It’s a Sunday, 8:30 start. Just in case anyone wanted to circle the date on their 2012 calendars as must-see-TV.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 1:58 PM EST up reply actions
I too was disappointed
yet i hope the team will band together and do all they can to make it uop to ward for leaving him hung out to dry more often than not this season…No,ward is NOT totally faultless…yet and now the team as a whole seem to flounder and drifting aimlessly…our new coach and assistant are making progress, but sadsly the team over all picked a very pea poor time to allow and have the wheels fall off at this time of the season. grant you no one wants to see their team all but desinigrate in front of them. Are there answers?/ yes..Will we as fans like those answers ? Probably NOT, but what are we the fan base to do ? Only each of you individually and collectivly who are close and hang out together @the RBCC can answer that …sadly therte will be situations and times when one team will all but own another..and so far the former welcome mats of the southeast are doing ALL the walking over the Canes…will this continue? only the Canes as a team will decide that..and all we fans can do is sit watch and wait…but for how long…but for how long ? True the canes are missing a few key players..and they all will be back ..but can we as fans wait? Will we wait ? sadder still Texas Stars beat the Checkers last night as well…for me the only bright spot was Spokane handled Everett with a win 5-2…but that was yesterday…today is “today”…amd in closing i remember Bibby Hull telling a very tired and butt dragging goalie Tony Esposito after a terrible loss..Learn from the past and go on ..and he did..he along with the hawks whipped their next 3 opponents..Detroit,Boston & Montreal…can the canes do the same ? sure..but they have to want to ..that’s learn from the past and go on….and go on…
9/11/01 - Never Forget !!
Long Live #63 The Condor
Go Canes & Checkers !!!
The Ward Meltdown
I did not see the actual meltdown on the bench by Cam Ward. Although if the meltdown had happened in some other games, I would have applauded Ward for showing fire, these first two or three goals were on him. He’s clearly feeling the pressure of an under-achieving team.
On the other hand, Murphy is a pleasure to watch. He’s young and rough around the edges; but he’s a winner through and through. I hope he’ll get some starts for the Hurricanes. It’s a great season for the Hurricanes to work in their young forwards. The young defensemen are doing quite well. McBain is making some defensive miscues, but that’s what is expected if you play young defensemen 25:29 minutes of ice time. I like the up tempo game the Hurricanes are playing.
If Cam Ward had not left the post open on the first lucky shot; and if LaRose had restrained himself on the penalty sequence where he tripped, slashed, and then cross-checked the Jets player, the game is much, much closer.
Come on Doug, if my aunt had a pair she’d be my uncle. Woulda, shoulda, coulda. While I agree things could of been diff. this is the reality. At las the org. has finally smoked the one constant imprtant guy, in Ward. While he isn’t totally to blame, like what kind of garbage team let’s the bad guys pummel almost 20 shots in the first at the guy, Ward isn’t the same guy he was.While Staal had a Staal night, 1 point, he can’t carry the team. Without Ward, this is the type of game we will see time and again.
Kinda hard to blame Rosie, they put him in a position to play way above his calibe. It’s a given he will fail and someimes they will be huge.
I’m glad Mo’s gone, but wtf has Muller done? Squat, zip, zero, nada. Another Mo with slightly better ties. I’m not sure which group of cretins is directing travesty, but it’s a real sham and shame. There are some very good players on this team and the powers that be are stilltrying to force a squre peg in a round hole. If they don’t at least experiment with the lines and the olks they got I don’t have the words for how deserving they are of the title loser and if people are even remotely like me, pretty fed up with Hurricanes hockey. I get no enjoyment from watching, only shame in rooting.
I am startig develope sympathy for Nail or whatever draft pick comes ths way. How awful it must be to be highly skilled and have that acknowledged by your piers only to be anchord to an entry level contract with this org.
Maybe JJ had the right idea?
A
Getting old sucks!
Hard to respond to such a cesspool of negativity. If you understood much about hockey you’d know there is a huge difference between Mo and Muller. Mo got his break very young and some would argue through connections. Muller has earned his way here through a stellar playing career where he was often the clear leader on his team. He then paid his coaching dues with a college team and then as an assistant in one of the most storied franchises in hockey. Ask any fan in Montreal what they think of him after seeing what he did there….. most want him as their head coach.
His approach to on ice play is very different than Mo’s. His is an aggressive, offence oriented, puck possession game where he will take the chances coming back the other way. For now he is trying to see whether he has the players that can adapt and play that system. It is very different that Mo’s and you don’t change years of a different philosophy overnight. He could likely win more games short term if they played a conservative D first system….. but then you would have what you trolled about for months…. Mo’s system.
The issue here is that they don’t have have the players. And you can’t make wholesale changes at a whim. Bringing up the Charlotte kids means you have to do something with the guys currently on the roster. It takes two teams to make a deal. Most are bargain shopping at the moment but that will change in March and we can get much more for them. That is just good business. And you can’t just send them to the minors without putting them on waivers and then getting nothing for them. Or put them in the press box….. that is expensive and it also reduces their trade value.
The mistakes on this team were made when JR put the team together this summer. We already talked about the Kaberle fiasco. Poni, Brent and Stewart have not brought much and took up roster spots that could have been used for prospects. We don’t have a true top pairing shut down D. And our lack of finishers is very obvious…… The money spent of Poni, Stewart, Brent and LaRose should have been spent to go get that player….. and several were available.
It is always easy to say “blow up this team” but doing it the right way so that you can have the assets to rebuild is tougher. Look at Edmonton…. they have done it wrong several times and only now are starting to get it right. Pittsburg hit rock bottom but rebuilt the right way. Look at the Wild. They had a hard time filing their rink but now are atop the West. It takes time and a plan. But one thing we do have his a coach that with the right players can get bring us a brand of exciting, winning hockey. And we have some blue chip defence prospects both on the team and in juniors/college. Now it is up to JR and PK to do their part in March and over the summer and go get the other peices. And if you are fed up with Canes hockey go buy a Penquins jersey and jump on their bandwagon.
I think you threw almost anything but the kitchen sink into the cesspool that is paladin, but there are a few things you didn’t include that I feel are glaring.
You rightfully pointed out that our leading scorer did not play but you neglected to mention the holes on defense. Not onlywas our one elite defenseman out injured, but we were playing a defenseman completely new to the team. I think that resulted in several miscues.
I agree that the team put together last summer will not fit with Muller’s coaching approach, but at least everyone seems to be “buying in” to what he wants. And trades will happen, even if they are nothing more than deadline deals. And the players kept will be those who form the new core of the team which can be built around in the offseason and under the new CBA.
by Chuck Burns on Dec 10, 2011 1:23 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
And one other point I forgot. This is, essentially, training camp and preseason. We are not likely to see a fully integrated team for weeks if not months.
by Chuck Burns on Dec 10, 2011 1:35 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Staal; What's Up With Him?
I think Staal is one of the best of the second tier stars in the NHL. He is not a generational player; but he’s a true star. Has he hit the emotional wall as a result of not having linemates who are near his skill, with the exception of Skinner? Is he just in an extended slump and will ultimately get his game back?
I wonder if Jim Rutherford would consider trading Staal for the right blockbuster deal? If so, what would that deal be? There are teams that would pay a king’s ransom for Staal. Is there any scenario a team would make an offer Jim Rutherford could not refuse?
Staal trade
I did not use to think so…….but I am not so sure anymore.
Although I agree with your assessment of Staal’s potential, the last couple of years have not been where the organization needs for him to be. He will be over $9mm in actual salary next year I think.
Staal has a NTC but I am not sure if it a full one or limited, likely full NTC so Staal will be participating in any trade decision. It would appear to me that ALL teams who do not have a true #1 center would get in line. Any trade would be a whopper and perhaps could involve more than 2 teams because of the large salary. Kinda makes me sick to really think about this one. I would really hope the answer is a true top line winger, any side. That would put a trade decision about Staal off another year or two.
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 10, 2011 3:13 PM EST up reply actions
If I were Jim Rutherford, I would keep Staal unless the earth moved and I got a deal that only a fool would turn down. I do think Staal is not your typical first line center in that he is shoot first and make passes later. I’d be strongly tempted to move him to wing if one of the young kids/prospects/#1 draft pick came up as a young Staal.
More and more I am convinced in today’s NHL, teams win with their first two lines. It takes at least three if not four elite or near elite forwards. I am having to re-think my dislike of Burke. His system of two star lines and two plumber lines may be right approach after all. I don’t really understand the degree of despair I read related to the Hurricanes. Skinner and Staal are great players who are both young. Ward is a first tier goalie. Faulk, Murphy, and McBain are blue chip prospects. Dumoulin is by all accounts another first tier prospect.
Rask and Dalpe have very high upper limit potential. Boychuk is improving; and among Muller, MacLean and Daniels, Boychuk should be a solid player for the Hurricanes. Ruutu is great as a second line right wing. Jokinen with the right linemates is excellent. Sutter is excellent as a shutdown center. There are plenty of good pieces. I just wish Karmanos would spend more money and let Rutherford have the finances to field a more competitive team on a consistent basis.
Muller is an excellent coach who will be able to help players reach their full potential. This season was all about too little money to spend, missing Cole, signing Kaberle and LaRose (and Ponikarovsky and Stewart) rather than going for a truly elite right wing. When Staal hit the skids, Kaberle flopped, and Ward struggled, it was indeed the perfect storm. Jim Rutherford’s recent interview says he knows he has to bring in two or three more impact players. It is what it is. The Hurricanes are in a downturn season; but with some good choices in the draft, and a good signing or two, the Hurricanes will be vastly improved next season.
AD,
I still don’t understand your reasoning behind moving Staal to wing. You say he is a shoot-first center and he normally is, but lately (probably because of a confidence issue) he is really dishing the puck well. He has really set up some good scoring chances, but his linemates are still struggling to put the puck in the net. I think he is underrated as a passer because of who has usually had to play with. He’s definitely not a Giroux, but I think center is where he needs to stay.
Regarding your theory on NHL teams top 6; I completely agree with you. To be successful, we need to have 3 or 4 top-end forwards and have to fill out the rest of those lines with good, complimentary players. Staal & Skinner are 2, but we need 1 or 2 more. While we should get a great player in the draft this offseason, we need to realize he might not make a huge impact next season. I think we Canes fans might be a little spoiled by Skinner’s amazing rookie season last year and seeing what RNH is doing this year. But is you look at the #1 picks from the past couple of seasons, they were good their rookie years (all posted lower 20’s in goals), but none were really difference makers those years. And while I really like Dalpe & Rask and I believe they can be bonafide top 6 players, neither are going to be NHL stars. They will most likely be in the same category as a Ruutu; a solid top 6 contributor. JR needs to go out and find or make available a young top 6 player and trade for him. You add a “true” top player to Staal, Skinner, & our upcoming draft pick; then you have the makings of a team that can compete.
We also need to find some defensemen. Faulk should be good and Dumoulin (even though still over a year away from the NHL) should be also. Murphy has great offensive abilities, but I am still very nervous about his ability to handle the physical side of the NHL. We need a good all-around defenseman to compliment this young defensive group. McBain has played well offensively the past couple of games, but it really appears that his development has stalled to me. He is horrible in his own end and has trouble handling the puck. I believe he should eventually be traded because his value in potential is worth more than his actual playing abilities.
I also think all the Finns should be made available for the right person in return. I love Jussi, but I’m just not sure he is the right fit for Muller’s system. I would like Ruutu to stay, but IMO his max salary should be at $4 million or below and I feel he will want more than what he is making right now. Pitkanen is an excellent skater, but he is extremely inconsistent for being our #1 defender. I’m not saying let these guys go for picks and/or prospects, but if a proven player is made available and it will cost one of these guys, then do.
And finally, PK is going to have to open his wallet. The division is going to get even tougher next season and this team needs talent. Character is a wonderful trait, but talent will win you more games (and make you more money). LaRose is a heart & soul guy, but so is a Dwyer or a Sutter or a Skinner. We don’t need 4 hearts. We need a heart, a brain, some hands, some legs, etc. We need to spend the money wisely instead of overpaying a career 4th liner or accumulating 3 or 4 project players. I think PK once referred to the Cup team as catching lightning in a bottle; while lightning doesn’t strike the same place twice, so try to do something different to get back to the Finals.
"We've got to risk implosion. We may explode into the biggest fireball this part of the galaxy has seen, but we've got to take that one in a million chance."
-- Captain Kirk in Star Trek 'The Naked Time'
by PackPride17 on Dec 10, 2011 10:51 PM EST up reply actions
I am really torn about the notion of a trade involving Staal. We would be giving up a lot but we better get back more…….but that is easy to say.
Here is a practical issue……..on paper the Canes look pretty good at the beginning of the season. I can see a little bit what JR was thinking last summer ON PAPER. However it is results that are important, not paper. When the game is actually played most times you can throw out the paper. We have paper blue chip prospects in Charlotte but none of them, except Skinner have yet to turn into those NHL’ers who match what you see on paper. In fact some of the blue chippers have had a couple of years to show who they are but have yet to crack the line-up in spite of being under the wing of Daniels. Some of that is their own “fault” some of that is the Canes fault. Ice rinks in North America are littered with the failed and forgotten blue chip prospect. Ours need to be given a better “audition”.
What does that mean now? Well, the current roster has a number of under-achieving bodies right up to the top line. JR has seen most of this roster for a couple of years, a roster that partly caused a coach to lose his job. If you ascribe to the notion of equal responsibility then 1/3 of the fault is management, 1/3 of the fault the coaches and 1/3 of the fault the players. I guess this is also part of the notion of how many passes you give out.
I am currently thinking that additional player changes are coming in the short term that are part of a longer term re-tooling of the roaster. We might not see that until closer to the deadline but I think it is coming. I think it will involve a major acquisition of a first line winger to give Staal another chance at redemption. We need a blue-chip winger anyway so even if Staal fails some objective has been achieved. In other words, the veteran roster left after this trade will also be in an “audition” the rest of the season. I am thinking once this season is done JR will have enough information to jettison the under performers hopeful through trading vet and blue chip alike.
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 11, 2011 10:32 AM EST up reply actions
Sittler
Paladin is a grumpy curmudgeon, but he’s our curmudgeon at CC. He left us and came back, and even though I may never agree with him, I’m glad to see him back on the board.
Let me ask you this: had the Canes been able to keep Whitney and Cole, how would you feel about these lines under Muller:
Stall Whitney Cole
Skins and Finns
Sutter Tlusty Dwyer
Brent Rosy Stewart
20/20 hindsight and all and it doesn’t address the D, but I’ll bet there’s a part of JR that regrets some of the pieces he’s lost.
for reals?
Another Mo with slightly better ties.
Have you watched the team pre-Muller and post-Muller. This kind of wtf game has happened in 1/6 games under Muller. Under Mo, it was every other game. The mean level of play has improved drastically. And the really poor game under Muller came without Skinner. I don’t believe Mo coached any games this year without Skinner. At any rate, results in the standings aren’t really there yet, but results visible to the eye are visible to the eye.
Also, it’s been two weeks.
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Dec 10, 2011 10:02 AM EST up reply actions
Yea, the team is actually to watch with Muller behind the bench. I like the fact that the team seems to be trying to implement new things into it’s game as opposed to the tired old MO system of hockey. I hope that they’ll start integrating a more offensive minded game and work on the puck possession.
For me the only frustrating thing at first was that it seemed like Muller was just going with the same lines that MO had left off with. Now though we’ve been seeing some different line combos and he’s changed it up on the PP – that’s already seen improvement. I think now we’ll start seeing more of the young guys being thrown into the mix cause I don’t think Muller has some bias against the young talent.
Megaweapon… Megaweapon… Megaweapon…
Muller and Line Combinations
Muller did not know the players. It made sense to start with the line combinations under Maurice so there would be a clean slate. He needed a control by having the same lines first to see how things would work with the status quo. It did not take very long for Muller and MacLean to reassess. It is still a work in progress.
For sure..
..as I say I’m already alot happier with the power play (though it’s still a work in progress) and I’ve liked that Dwyer seems to be getting rewarded for his recent efforts out there. Can’t wait for Harrison to get back into the mix.
Megaweapon… Megaweapon… Megaweapon…
It was the 3rd game in 4 nights on the road, first game for Spacek, only 11 forwards dressed, Ward was a mere mortal. This game under Mo would have been a disaster. Staal would have been triple shifted, LaRose double and Ward pulled when the score hit 6 zip. Under Muller there was a 3rd period attempted comeback with desperation apparent. The team is in the same hole, but they’ve stopped digging deeper. That is a huge improvement.
I’m not sure I’d call it a meltdown for most netminders in those circumstances. But for those that know Cam it was about as much negative emotion as we have probably ever seen out of him. Cam has extremely strong Christian faith and can usually look for comfort in his faith when things go really well or badly….. he doesn’t normally take the glory for himself nor blame others. I’d love to know just exactly what he was yelling down the bench. So while that may have been a typical reaction for many goalies in that circumstance, for him that was a very major display of outward emotion and it would be interesting to know what’s up with him.
Few games are won or lost 1-0, but when you have had so much not go your way like the Canes are experiencing, a first goal against like that must be a like " here we go again". I didn’t like Cam’s positioning on that goal and although Tripp said it, I have to agree that he should have been challenging out higher in the net on the second goal and not allowing the Jets player to establish position at the top of his crease. There was a bit of contact but when you are the aggressor you don’t find yourself on your butt as often.
Team shows minutes of great cycling, puck control and then it ends with a lame shot or a blocked shot. Goes back to the need for true snipers. Then it goes into our end and into the net. Frustrating team to watch at the moment. Playing lights out when you are down 4-0 isn’t even much of a moral victory. But I suppose that this will pretty much be our lot in life for the rest of the season. I like Muller’s aggressive offence but he doesn’t have the horses to win consistently and when they do, it will be need to be a night where we commit few mistakes and play all 60 minutes. We simply don’t have the talent to win when we just play ok.
I can read lips pretty well. Cam was using vocabulary that would be found in the Bruce Boudreau lexicon of unhappy comments. I watched this morning again the Edmonton game. The major difference was the movement of the forwards; and particularly their physicality in holding position defensively and going hard on the back check. It was a back to back in a different time zone. Skinner and Pitkanen were missing last night. Harrison is missing. Kaberle was just traded (hurray), but Spacek was thrown right into the mix.
I didn’t remember to record the Winnipeg game, so I’ll have to wait to see it again on Game Center. All in all, Jim Rutherford did not bring in the players needed to fill the holes. I do have a different impression of some of the players. Brent does great on the fourth line, I think; but yes, the Hurricanes don’t play the fourth line enough to make Brent the team savior.
It is virtually inarguable, I believe, that if Jim Rutherford had done as you stated and pooled the money spent on Poni, Stewart, Brent and LaRose, he could have obtained a game changer player. Where the Hurricanes suffer is on the first line. It is going to take a lot of money to purchase/sign that player. I wholeheartedly agree that if Jim Rutherford has to trade or not re-sign Ponikarovsky, Stewart, LaRose, and Brent to have the cash in hand to make a splash on the first line, he has to choice but to do so. I’d think that trading Gleason and LaRose and not re-signing Spacek would free up more than ample cash to make that kind of big impact deal.
No scoring threat without Skinner. Ward is obviously frustrated by his performance and the lack of performance of his defense – McBain awful, Gleason slow as hell. Jokinen can’t seem to do anything right at the moment. The line of Sutter, Dwyer and Tlusty seem to be the only ones trying shift and shift. The other forwards are pretty dam useless.
I believe the line you mentioned as the only one trying shift to shift wasn’t together the last game.
"We've got to risk implosion. We may explode into the biggest fireball this part of the galaxy has seen, but we've got to take that one in a million chance."
-- Captain Kirk in Star Trek 'The Naked Time'
by PackPride17 on Dec 10, 2011 1:02 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
I believe you’re right and Staal was still with Dwyer and Tlusty IIRC. Sutter had Poni and LaRose.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 1:04 PM EST up reply actions
Thinking about it more, I had the Sutter line wrong. Poni was with Ruu and Jussi. Sutter was with LaRose and Nodl.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 1:12 PM EST up reply actions
I like Sutter w/ Dwyer and Trusty – those guys seem to click well together.
Though I have liked seeing Dwyer with Staal. Dwyer’s got good sense out there and has shown he’s got some speed. He’s shown himself to be a solid player so while at first I didn’t like him being split up from Sutter’s line I see the logic in having him play with the Staalion.
Megaweapon… Megaweapon… Megaweapon…
Things could be worse!
From Twitter:
Proteautype: Just think, at this time yesterday, Tomas Kaberle still wasn’t a member of the Canadiens. Savor the memories, Habs fans!
Our new man Spacek scored 2 points last night and will probably give Faulk a different perspective. Although I would bring Boychuk up to replace Skinner in Toronto (gotta be a CLT-YYZ flight) and see if he might be able to stir up the Juice. We need the big move that everyone is talking about – JR has now fixed his defensive problem from the summer – now how do we fix the offensive one?
I also agree that Murphy has earned his shot as a starter (he is still 1.000 Save% and 0 GAA), but is the ACC the place to do it? Sit Wardo, send Murphy back to the minors and let the P-Dawg get the start. Then next week, in Raleigh, let Murphy get the start. This is still emergency injury time, so I don’t think we have a waiver risk. It will also send a message to Cam, and give him a few days to cool down.
And what has happened to Gleason?
would this be of interest?
LA KINGS INSIDER: Teams will have until 9 AM PT today to put in claims on forward Ethan Moreau, who was placed on waivers by the Kings yesterday.
SPECTOR’S NOTE: Not a trade rumor, but I felt it was worthwhile noting here. Moreau was once highly regarded as a heart-and-soul physical leader and checker, but age and injuries have caught up with him in recent years. Should be interesting to see if a rival team picks him off the waiver wire today.
If we bring in Ethan Moreau, would this allow us to use Ruutu as part of the bait for a top 6 forward?
I think Murphy should get the start in Toronto. Cam has not been the same for a while and it might be good for him to sit and watch. It also seems that the Canes play a little tighter when the kid is in the nets. Its not a long-term solution, but Cam needs a wake up call.
"We've got to risk implosion. We may explode into the biggest fireball this part of the galaxy has seen, but we've got to take that one in a million chance."
-- Captain Kirk in Star Trek 'The Naked Time'
by PackPride17 on Dec 10, 2011 1:06 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Last Night
I have come to believe that this team is not the team Canes management envisions as appropriate for the next several years. It is certainly not “back to square one” for JR but he probable is thinking that it certainly feels like it. That thought might very well mean JR becomes one of the most active GM between now and the trade deadline and perhaps again after July 1.
I could have never predicted that I would have ever seen Cam react they way I saw him last night. I was stunned. More importantly it certainly seemed the bench was stunned as well from the look on the faces. Whatever the reason, the reaction from the players was profound because that 3rd period this changed dramatically for the good.
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
Cam's Actions
Cam threw a public ‘temper tantrum’, ‘called out his team mates’, and his coach(for pulling him)..(it appeared to me)…I NEVER thought I would see that. Things are worse than I thought.
was pretty scary
the scary part was the fact that it was “pubic” and everyone saw it happen. Wasn’t it last month (against the Habs if I remember right) that there was all the scuttlebutt about a huge blow up in the Canes locker room and reports were that a goalie stick was seen flying out through the locker room door? Everyone’s frustrated. Everything burns.
Megaweapon… Megaweapon… Megaweapon…
Makes sense. I did not remember that until you mentioned it above. Practice today (Sunday) is closed……..none one has yet said why. Looks light some heart to heart talk is in order. If that was Cam’s stick that sailed out of the room then he is really showing the most pressure I have ever seen from him.
JR has to know of all this……….
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 11, 2011 12:10 PM EST up reply actions
I don’t see how Ward can be given another start. I know Murphy is young and looked slightly out of place last night on some shots (on at least a couple of occasions, the defense saved him), but Ward has down nothing to give him the right to start over Murphy. Ward can be a great goalie at times, but right now, he is an average goalie for whatever reason. The defense is partially to blame for allowing 19 shots in the first period, but when you look at the chances numbers, you realize that a lot of those shots were not exactly high quality. I can’t think of Ward making any immensely difficult saves last night, but I do remember him letting in 3 softies due to his poor positioning. I can’t imagine how demoralizing it is for a team to see their all-star goalie let in a goal from Byfuligegnndfn from behind the goal line in the first minute of the game because he wasn’t paying attention again.
Time to give Murphy the chance. We aren’t really throwing him to the dogs at the ACC. It’s a Tuesday night so it will be mostly suits anyway. And throwing him into a 4-0 game in Winnipeg is much, much worse than the ACC will ever be.
This game basically showed how outright bad the team is. Well, most of the games this season have shown that, but this game particularly. Without Skinner, we have very few scoring threats. Jokinen is nobody without Skinner. Poni has potential but still is fighting the puck (and his legs). Stewart is devoid of talent. Brent doesn’t seem to be much of an upgrade. McBain is still as bad as ever, but it is more noticeable now without Kaberle here. Gleason is slow and a sissy. Allen has stopped checking. Didn’t even notice Joslin was playing last night. LaRose has no business above the fourth line.
But look on the bright side: we don’t have Kaberle anymore!
It is painfully obvious why the Jets passed on Stewart. Not enough talent for the NHL. He could have been easily been replaced by someone from the Checkers.
Stewart
True, he isn’t a great skater, but he is fast. He obviously has a problem with his focus. Some shifts he goes hard, others just floats around not doing much of anything.
by Hockey Drills on Dec 10, 2011 2:46 PM EST up reply actions
Some Individual Questions
Not a game which makes you feel good unless as a result of the 3rd period you see the cup 1/3 full rather than 2/3 empty. It did raise some questions though.
What is happening to Jokinen? He is putting together a series of bad games, last night seeming the worse I have seen him play and brother it was a stinker (no offense to a particular blogger).
What is happening to Gleason? He gets married, has a kid, comes in to camp with less weight and supposedly more jump and speed because of it. But, he has degraded into one of the slowest Canes on the ice and makes mistake after mistake. Granted he contributes in other ways but skating and judgement on the ice issues are things that were not as significant in years past.
What is happening to McBain? Last year he was one of the better D on the ice on a reasonable basis. Although his offensive side has much improved in the last several games, his defensive side is a struggle. He just looks and plays like he is very uncomfortable. Sometimes the normal progression for a D is two steps forward and one step back but thought that was behind him last year.
And finally, what is happening to Staal? I remember another slow start a couple of years ago where he was invisible in most early games. We did not learn until the season was over that he was constantly battling several injuries throughout most of that year.
Regardless, today I see the face of frustration worn on his face on a fairly regular basis. I am beginning to become very concerned with his current and continued role on this team. He is not having fun and it shows. He wears his emotion on his sleeve and that would be great if it were positive, not so great because it surely looks negative.
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 10, 2011 10:38 AM EST reply actions
Here’s another individual question. What happened to my favorite Finn? Tuomo rode the pine for the last 10 minutes of the game. He went off the ice normally at the end of his shift and stayed on the bench. I get that Skinner being out caused some adjustments, but it wasn’t like Tuomo hasn’t played with other linemates or has been stinking up the joint. He wasn’t on the power play and wasn’t part of the late 6-on-5. I asked Maniscalco to ask Forslund, and he didn’t seem to notice any issues. I rewatched a lot of the broadcast to see if I could find a play where he either pulled up gimpy or did something to piss off the coach, but couldn’t find anything. After 2 goals in 2 straight games, I found it a little curious.
I missed that. He was not at his best last night but he was not bad either. Certainly his play is at a higher level than the ones I mentioned originally.
So it is said that if you know your enemies and know yourself, you can win a hundred battles without a single loss.
If you only know yourself, but not your opponent, you may win or may lose.
If you know neither yourself nor your enemy, you will always endanger yourself.
Sun Tzu circa 4th Century BC
by hurricanefever on Dec 10, 2011 11:12 AM EST up reply actions
"Size matters not. Look at me. Judge me by my size, do you? Hmm? Hmm. And well you should not. For my ally is the Force, and a powerful ally it is.......yoda
This too shall pass…….give the guys a little time, much has happened in the last couple of months……..if we are this frustrated as fans…think of how the locker room must feel…..
All we need is a little time, once all the parts start clicking, we goona shock the world…
Set 'em up Joe: the world is upside-down
Things are grim here in the Canes Country saloon. While we shouldn’t go overboard about last night because Skinner, Pitkanen and Harrison were out, Faulk and McBain are learning the ropes and Spacek is new, we do need to worry about whether the Canes have it in them to do what’s necessary for a shot at a brighter future.
The current struggles are mostly because there’s just not enough scoring or playmaking talent at forward despite using high draft choices on forwards who supposedly have the kind of talent that’s lacking. (As often discussed, the Canes have 3 forwards on the roster that they drafted and all were essentially NHL-ready on draft day.) Either the top forward prospects were draft mistakes, like Paradis, or the Canes don’t know how to get anything out of them. Statistically, Dalpe and Boychuk look worse as AHL players this season than last. Boychuk is no longer a point-per-game AHL player. Dalpe has 5 points in 11 AHL games to go with 0 points in 9 NHL games. Their NHL chances and trade value are sinking fast.
Reclamation projects are not going to upgrade the talent at forward enough to matter. It’s doubtful any established scoring forwards will be available, and even if they are, the Canes won’t pay what it takes to get them. The only viable path to upgrading talent seems to be the draft, but based on their draft history, the Canes will have to be drafting at the very top to get a forward who makes a difference next season or ever. As fans, we have to learn AD’s trick of celebrating another victory in the Fail for Nail campaign as we mourn each loss.
The suspense from here on out is about whether Canes’ management will do what’s necessary for the long term or trade for quick, marginal improvement at the future’s expense. Bad as they are, the Canes have 9 forwards under contract for next year. Only 3 or 4 belong on scoring lines (4 if you believe Sutter does). Trades should be for prospects with genuine scoring-line talent or draft picks only. Even expiring contracts are questionable if there’s a risk the players will get the Canes out of the cellar.
The world has to be upside-down this season to get it rightside-up for 2012 – 13.
by curiouscanesfan on Dec 10, 2011 11:36 AM EST reply actions
Refresh my memory. Who other than Staal and Skinner are Canes-drafted players who showed they were NHL ready on their draft day?
by Chuck Burns on Dec 10, 2011 2:05 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Sutter wasn’t a guy who took 120 games in the AHL and emerged as a legit NHL player. The first year as a pro, it was 7 games in the AHL and none in the NHL. The second year, 50 games in the NHL and 22 in the AHL. In terms of NHL-readiness, Sutter seems to me to belong with Staal and Skinner instead of Boychuk, Bowman and Dalpe. In terms of overall ability, it’s debatable whether Sutter belongs with Staal and Skinner, but Sutter is clearly the best defender and flashes offensive skills too.
by curiouscanesfan on Dec 11, 2011 10:14 AM EST up reply actions
Perspective is a cool thing
Like Sittler27 pointed out above, Muller has a totally different system and is building for the future, evaluating current players. Jokinen, Gleason, they will go soon. All will be well — in time…
LET'S GO CANES -- THE SEASON AIN'T OVER YET!!!
Terry Jones of the Edmonton Sun just tweeted that Andy Sutton got 10 games, but I haven’t seen it anywhere else
@sunterryjones Andy Sutton suspended 10 games. That’s double his first one. Won’t play again this calendar year. And no debate here. Got what he deserved.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 2:34 PM EST reply actions
Amen to that. I love tough physical hockey, but Sutton is over the top. With all that we now know about the lingering affects of head shots, guys like him need to be sat down.
He apparently was mistaken – the final word with video was just 8 games. But there ya go.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 9:37 PM EST up reply actions
Muller on HNIC right now. Didn’t even know he would be on!
"I'm not going to waste my time with Tuukka Rask" - Cam Ward
You’re not on twitter are you?
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 3:23 PM EST up reply actions
Pre-emptive jinx LOL. I was getting ready to say we both tweeted it.
by Jamie Kellner on Dec 10, 2011 3:24 PM EST up reply actions
Ha, no I’m not. Was just watching the Devils-Canadians game and they interviewed him – didn’t know he was scheduled. I’m guessing Twitter is where is all the info is at nowadays. Thinking maybe to sign up for one sometime. I thought it was just a quick fad that would pass but it seems to be thing now – all the breaking news seems to be reported via Twitter, lol!
"I'm not going to waste my time with Tuukka Rask" - Cam Ward
If you just follow a few people it’s not that distracting. At least that’s what I’m told….. #addicted
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 9:38 PM EST up reply actions
yeah, it wasn't that bad for the brief time that I only followed a few people
but then came the four Tennessee beat writers, three Lightning beat writers, the Rocky Top Talk folks, the Raw Charge folks, EDSBS. . . now it’s distracting.
@RealTimeWWII is pretty awesome though
If I cared more about my UNC side, I'd call myself "Tar Volon," and that'd be awesome.
Bolts, Canes, Preds (now in different conferences!). Canes mini-STH. Southern hockey solidarity
Rocky Top Talk
by Incipient_Senescence on Dec 10, 2011 10:07 PM EST up reply actions
I just posted the Shanaban video on the front page, but in the text I includes the link to a video of the game in NJ this afternoon which includes the Kirk Muller segment.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Dec 10, 2011 10:13 PM EST up reply actions
Late to post
Agree with most things posted, but one thing really bothered me last night, over and over again…
….They kept cutting away from Kirk and going back to the game! Ok, just kidding….
OK in all seriousness, I can not see how we were credited with the hits we were. This team played soft. When forwards had the puck or were pursuing the puck, they pulled up instead of skating through the opposition. Stewart seems out to avoid contact even with his size. We pulled up and dodged at the blue line, we pulled up and used stick checks in our own zone, we seemed to give up in puck battles because we didn’t want to fight for posession.
It was pathetic and weak, very disheartening, and made me want to get rid of all of them. Not sure when we became a team of panty waists. We didn’t start the year that way, but we are now.
Gleason started the year more physical, as did Allen. Gone now. Ruutu has disappeared as a hitter. We have Dwyer, perhaps the smallest guy on the team, and LaRose as our only physical forwards. The only ones willing to skate through checks consistently. Man that’s just wrong and sad.
That tells me they lost team belief, team cohesion. They are unwilling to work or take a beating for their team mates or the team. No one sees anyone else willing to bust their ass, so no one else will. And there’s no leadership on ice setting that tone to get their attention and make them start. Muller inherited a very bad culture and situation here. Not sure if He can correct it without major player changes now…..
No sure….
Wow!
You are very right! The only reason that they were able to beat the Oil was because they were equally soft and even more flatfooted. On ice leadership is nonexistent. Our C and A’s either don’t possess the ability to lead by example or extensive experience to lean on.
I feel that the lack of motivation of the players has been unfairly blamed on Paul Maurice. My own opinion now, is that while Muller can’t be expected to work miracles, he has had enough time to at least muster some enthusiasm and get some energy from the room. I think time will prove him to be a competent and successfull coach, but it won’t be with this group on the ice. I felt before PM was fired, and still feel, that the blame for this trainwreck fall’s sqaurely on the players, and disproportionately more on some than others.
Bad culture indeed. Probably from on ice personnel.
oh man...cutting away from Kirk...
All I could think about every time they showed him on the screen was those 2 really hot female Jet’s fans sitting behind him. I was surprised he didn’t turn around a few times and check them out. :)
Ready for the Canes to win the Cup again! :)
Speaking of goals that should/shouldn't be goals...
Was watching the ducks/preds game tonight – and saw a situation similar to what happened to us where the ref was in the motions of blowing the whistle – and the puck got pushed in – a second before he actually blew it – but he was in the motions of doing so, and waved it off. Unlike the ref in our game where he didn’t blow his whistle, but he was in the motions of doing so. :(
Ready for the Canes to win the Cup again! :)
Which is the right call. If the referee is in the process of blowing the whistle, the play be dead at that point. We’ve seen it countless times in years prior where we have scored a goal but the referee waved it off or the other team scored a goal and the referee blew it off because he was about to blow the whistle, although he never actually blew it. The referee in the Edmonton game was in the process of blowing the whistle, so he should have waved off the goal, but he didn’t.
Unfortunately, the whistle is another thing that is not reviewable. I don’t understand why can put so much importance on making sure every goal is a legitimate goal, but at the same time, not allow review of some of the most common reasons why the legitimacy of goals is questions (whistles, goaltender interference)
BTW...
Jet’s got completely owned by the Redwings too. :)
Too bad they didn’t play their other goalie instead of Chris Mason. We might have won. Maybe. :)
Ready for the Canes to win the Cup again! :)
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