Last Time Hurricanes Traded With Panthers? No Complaints
by Bob Wage on Mar 9, 2011 8:00 AM EST
in Carolina Hurricanes Analysis
Email
PrintThere is an old saying out there that a team should not trade within their own division. The Carolina Hurricanes have done it a few times though, and have had some pretty good success to date.
For instance, the trade a couple of years ago in which the Canes acquired Jussi Jokinen from the Tampa Bay Lightning certainly has worked out well.
This season, the team is hoping to hit pay dirt again with another couple of trades within the division, this time with the Florida Panthers. Recently, the Hurricanes traded Ryan Carter and a fifth round draft pick for Cory Stillman, then sent Sergei Samsonov to the Panthers in exchange for defenseman Bryan Allen.
The last time, and the only other time the Hurricanes dealt with the Panthers was in January of 2002 when they traded Sandis Ozolinsh and Byron Ritchie to the Cats for Bret Hedican, Kevyn Adams, and Tomas Malec. How did that work out?
Ritchie was a utility player who had about the same success in Florida as he had in Carolina. Ozolinsh was a very highly paid, offensive minded defenseman who never fit in well with Paul Maurice's system. But while he scored more points in Florida after the trade, the Panthers traded him again the very next season to Anaheim for a package that included Matt Cullen, of all players.
While Malec, who was a prospect, never panned out for the Canes, Hedican and Adams both fit in immediately and turned out to be fixtures of the team for years to come, including in the Stanley Cup winning year in 2006.
In 2002, Jim Rutherford traded skill for character. Hedican and Adams weren't high scoring or flashy, but they were blood and guts types who strengthened the resolve of the team and they were both positive contributors all the way to the 2002 Stanley Cup Finals.
Cory Stillman and Bryan Allen are not Bret Hedican and Kevyn Adams, but this trade is similar in that Rutherford was able to bring in quick fixes to what the team needs.
Stillman has already been a shot in the arm to the offense and has four points, (2G 2A), in just five games. So far Allen is showing an abundance of the toughness the team has been craving, especially while on the penalty kill.
Perhaps even more importantly, like Adams and Hedican, both of these players are character guys who bring intangible qualities with them. Will that be enough to help the Hurricanes get into the playoffs and have postseason success? We will see.
Speaking of inter-divisional trades, in March of that same year Rutherford traded fan favorites Chris Dingman and Shane Willis to Tampa Bay in exchange for a young, but pretty well-traveled goalie Kevin Weekes. Some fans were not very happy about that trade until Weekes turned out to be a major factor in the first round win against the New Jersey Devils.
The backup replaced workhorse Arturs Irbe in the series and put together two straight playoff shutouts. He also made what is still known as "The Save" on John Madden, in an overtime win against those Devils.
Perhaps Carolina should do a bit more trading in the future within the division?
38 comments
|
0 recs |
Do you like this story?
Comments
i had to smile as
I had the thought..Gee Bob a slow “news day” type of situation…but in reality…you are right Bob…the canes in the last several years have done more than just Okay with inter-divisional trades…but seeing JR only does this when it or he sees a good out come ..anmd as you pointed out…JR’s sucess ratre is rather impressive…Thanks Bob this fan is ready for tonight !!
All We have Now is HOPE ! Go Canes !!
Ya know I keep forgetting that K Adams and Hedi cam over together. The year after the cup would start off with a thud when Hedi punched him in the face for chirping him. Not long after that Kevyn would be a desert dog in exchange for Sieds. What did we get when we shipped off Hedi to Anaheim?
He didn’t come out of retirement. He was just a UFA.
by Cory Lavalette on Mar 9, 2011 9:13 AM EST up reply actions
not really, he was unsure whether he was going to come back after his last game as Cane. A good situation presented itself in Anaheim where he had recently moved his family.
Pretty sure Hedican signed with the Ducks after his contract was finished here.
Phoblographer and Finn Aficionado
SISU
by Jamie Kellner on Mar 9, 2011 9:09 AM EST up reply actions
In case anyone cares about 2nite's game...
Byfuglien is out of the lineup… :-)
"I’m tired of being a fringe team and needing a lot of things to go right to make the playoffs." - C-Leaguer
Thought that this was a game decision and that Atlanta called up a d-man just in case he couldn’t go with a lower body concern. Have you heard that he is definitely out?
Cory Stillman and Bryan Allen are not Bret Hedican and Kevyn Adams,
No, here’s hoping they are better. Hedican was great, don’t get me wrong, but I think these two are the more skilled players. I hope we keep them both around (yes I know Allen is signed through next year, and yes, only if we let some other players go to make more room for the prospects).
Looking at it, that might work too… If Stillman was paid about what Jokinen gets now, and Jokinen paid about what Stillman gets, that would be great. Let Larose walk, keeping one forward spot definitely open for Boychuk or Dalpe, and letting the other prospects fight it out with Tlusty for the other top-nine role.
Keeping Stillman scares me… players degrade fast in the NHL as age takes its toll. Maybe a 1 year cheap contract would be ok but anything else just seems like a bad idea.
Heard that same logic with Mark Recchi when we didn’t sign him in 2006. Seems to have worked out pretty well for Pittsburg and Boston.
Keeping Stillman or Having Stillman as a rental
sittler27: 2011-2012: if Stllman is re-signed would you anticipate Boychuk & Dalpe also playing for the Hurricanes? If so, which two forwards presently on the team would you jettison?
I know you asked Sittler, but I would jettison Larose (Dwyer is way cheaper), and let Dalpe, Boychuck and Tlusty battle it out for the two top nine positions (Staal, Sutter, Skinner, Ruutu, Jokinen, Cole and Stillman being the other seven). I would keep some combo of Dwyer/Samsone/Bodie/Larose for the fourth line… maybe someone else from CLT, but not one of the talented prospects.
In short, I think it would be ideal if both Boychuck and Dalpe made it as regulars next year, but I think it would be a mistake to plan on it as a sure thing. Better to sign Stillman to a cheap one-year deal than to have to hunt for another top-nine guy mid-season next year. If both Boychuck and Dalpe are ready to be regulars, let them push out another marginal player like Tlusty. If all three are playing lights-out, then let them push out someone else from the top nine.
10 Top Nine Players
I do count 10 legitimate top nine players among the Hurricanes forwards, if Stillman is re-signed; and assuming LaRose is not re-signed. It’s a good problem to have. I wonder whether it couldn’t make sense to use the fourth line as the energy, puck possession, hitting line, but with players who are quite capable of being top nine players. In other words, as I see the progression of talent on the Hurricanes, it is going to mean keeping an NHL ready prospect in Charlotte if Stillman is re-signed or unless the fourth line is made more relevant to the outcome of the game by being played more minutes.
As I see it, Skinner will come back stronger and more ready to play a second line center.
If Stillman is re-signed, the first line probably will continue to be Stillman/Staal/Cole.
If Skinner is ready for second line center duty, there are a number of choices, including Jokinen/Skinner/Ruutu; Boychuk/Skinner/Ruutu; Dalpe/Skinner/Ruutu.
The third line also has a number of variations that should work, including Jokinen/Sutter/Tlusty; Boychuk/Sutter/Tlusty; Dalpe/Sutter/Tlusty
If the fourth line is going to be used as penalty killers and energy guys for 5 minutes a game, it’s hard to see a younger prospect getting too much benefit from being on the fourth line in terms of development. If the fourth line is used 8 to 10 minutes regularly, the fourth line can be more of a factor in the game. If so, having some of the talented young players on the fourth line with Dwyer/Bodie could make sense.
I suppose it depends on what other teams are going to offer Stillman. Whitney received a two year contract for $3,000,000 each year. I can’t see the Hurricanes matching that salary. Stillman has been excellent for the Hurricanes; and he does seem to be the kind of experienced forward who could help the development of younger players. It also depends on how confident Jim Rutherford is in Boychuk and Dalpe being fully ready for the NHL. I’m guessing both Boychuk and Dalpe will make the kind of improvement Sutter made; but I also thought they both would be inarguably ready this season.
Here’s two sample of forward lines, assuming Stillman is signed and LaRose is not re-signed:
Stillman/Staal/Cole
Boychuk/Skinner/Ruutu
Dalpe/Sutter/Jokinen
Tlusty/Dwyer/Bodie
OR
Stillman/Staal/Cole
Dalpe/Skinner/Ruutu
Boychuk/Sutter/Jokinen
Tlusty/Dwyer/Bodie
I think Tlusty is much more than a marginal player; and if he can stay healthy, he will be a consistent top nine player, I believe. I also think Bodie is skating better and better this season. I am hoping by next season Bodie can convert some of the scoring chances he is getting. I also would not be surprised if Boychuk and Dalpe were to come to camp as “fit” as Skinner to see Boychuk/Skinner/Dalpe even though they are all young players. Boychuk and Dalpe continue to play extremely well when they are on the same line.
Bodie is the player that seems to be just taking up space on our roster.
Doesn’t score, can’t play special teams, can’t reliably fill in above the fourth line level, and doesn’t even fight that well.
Need double-duty out of our fourth line players, especially since Mo is only going to be giving them 3 or 4 shifts in each period, and even less if we’re trailing in the third.
Here we are now...entertain us.
The problem with having 10 top-9 players is our coach. He plays the 4th line 5-6 minutes a night and does not trust any player he hasn’t seen play 100 games with a top-9 position. Do we really want Boychuk, Dalpe, or Tlusty wasting away on the 4th line?
Bodie and his Goal
Bodie had a beautiful goal last night and was a significant contributor in less than 6 minutes of TOI. Forslund pointed out that Bodie is working hard to improve his game; and referenced Bodie’s work with Tom Rowe prior to practice. I do think the coaches continue to under-utilize the fourth line. Last night against the Thrashers the fourth line came out with jump when other lines seems sluggish. I don’t know that Maurice will alter his 5 to 6 minute a game philosophy on the fourth line no matter what the personnel looked like on the team. I don’t see any reason for Boychuk, Dalpe, or Tlusty to spend valuable development time on the fourth line if all they get per game is 4 or 5 minutes on the ice.
On the other hand, the Hurricanes have an abundance of talent at forward. I’d hope the Hurricanes coaches would consider revamping their view of the fourth line’s time on ice to accommodate the situation where the fourth line happens in some games to be the best line on the ice.
Good example, but no one worked harder than Brind’Amour and his skills suddenly vanished. There are lots of other examples. Aaron Ward’s decline is fresh in local memory. Recchi is a spectacular exception, not the rule.
by curiouscanesfan on Mar 9, 2011 3:09 PM EST up reply actions
Stillman could be 3 steps behind and still make plays by outsmarting everyone on the ice.
If they knew anything about the game, they'd be in it
by Killswitch on Mar 9, 2011 6:01 PM EST via mobile up reply actions
Making plays, he has the brains to do that forever..
But when he falls 3 steps behind (or 3 seconds behind) the play, stands still, and lets Patrick Sharp/Jonathan Toews rob him in the defensive zone leading to an easy goal… Then we have problems.
Stillman: pros and cons
I think there are both pros and cons to Stillman’s play. I admit I had him on my list of former Canes I hoped Jim Rutherford would not re-sign due to his lack of speed. I also remember both the amazing Stillman from 2005-2006 and the sound of his name constantly being called after key Hurricanes goals were scored. I remember as well seeing Stillman in 2006-2007 being one of the veterans who too often was disengaged.
Stillman has played excellently and he has made some spectacular players. Unfortunately, his lack of speed does show. Against Chicago he was pick-pocketed early in the game and set the tone for a beatdown. Stillman last night blew his defensive coverage and was responsible for one of two goals. He also made some great plays offensively that were key reasons the Hurricanes salvaged a point.
I hope Jim Rutherford will not be tempted to re-sign Stillman unless Stillman takes a huge pay-cut and takes a one year contract. Even then, I’d prefer to see Boychuk and Dalpe next season. Last night’s game was a reminder to me that the Hurricanes need to add offensive firepower. I don’t see the Hurricanes strength being their defensive prowess. I think the Hurricanes will do best as a fast, offensively explosive team that focuses on defense. It’s a paradox; but in the end, adding more offensively gifted players will help the Hurricanes defense.
The Early Years
Even before my time as a fan of the Hurricanes, we made another trade with the Panthers in March 1998, sending goalie Kirk McLean (acquired in January along with Martin Gelinas from Vancouver for goalie Sean Burke, and wingers Geoff Sanderson and Enrico Ciccone) to the Panthers for RW Ray Sheppard.
Here we are now...entertain us.
Comments For This Post Are Closed
Secondary Sidebar
User Tools
Related FanPosts on Canes Country
Related FanShots on Canes Country
FanPosts
Community blog posts and discussion.
Recent FanPosts
FanShots
Quick hits of video, photos, quotes, chats, links and lists that you find around the web.
Recent FanShots
In Association With
Latest Puck Daddy - NHL from Yahoo! Sports
- Why the Devils and the Kings are evidence the Capitals shouldn’t trade Alex Ovechkin
- Eulogy: Remembering the 2011-12 New York Rangers
- Stanley Cup Final: 5 keys for New Jersey Devils and Los Angeles Kings
- Friday’s Three Stars: Devils head to Final; Brodeur, Kovalchuk the difference in Game 6
- Devils eliminate Rangers in Game 6, ending fear of the past, setting course for the future
