Canes' defense in good hands
by Lee Phillips on Jun 28, 2011 10:01 AM EDT
in Canes Country Points
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With the selection of defenseman Ryan Murphy during last week's NHL Entry Draft, the Hurricanes not only gained another prospect for the future, they added another cog in the defensive machine that will someday be a force to be reckoned with.
Quality recent drafts combined with smart trading and free agent signings have led many to believe that Carolina GM Jim Rutherford could be stockpiling one of the most deadly defensive systems this franchise has ever seen. The Hurricanes have mixed in depth at forward with the drafts of Zac Dalpe, Zach Boychuk, Riley Nash, Jerome Samson and even the newly-signed Justin Shugg, but the real threat that NHL teams will realize come from the blueline.
Murphy is an undersized, offensive defenseman who was ranked in just about everybody's top-10 this year. He scored 26 goals for the Kitchener Rangers last season and came close to 80 points. His smooth puck-handling and booming shot will make him dangerous every time he goes over the boards - especially on the power play. He needs a little conditioning and coaching on how to improve his overall defensive game, but those things will come with time.
Drafting Murphy wouldn't have look so impressive to the hockey world had it not been for the supporting cast around him as well.
The most highly-touted defenseman Rutherford has is Justin Faulk. Faulk, like Murphy, is an offensive-minded defenseman. He is extremely comfortable with the puck, something especially valuable among young defenseman, and has the physical appearance to be a beast on the blueline. Faulk can get into the rough stuff and has a big frame (6' 0", 205 lbs.), but is also agile and swift on his skates. Faulk will certainly be a top-4 defenseman who sees time on a power play unit in the future.
Faulk was brought in to help the Charlotte Checkers with their playoff run this past spring and contributed what he could. While he only notched two assists, Faulk played a mature game and looked comfortable on the ice with teammates that he had only known for a matter of weeks. That adaptability will help Faulk earn his way up to the Canes in the coming years.
The Canes might have also found a hidden gem via the draft when they selected Kyle Lawson in the 7th round in 2005. Throughout his career at the University of Notre Dame, Lawson has proven to be a reliable player with a good all-around game. In only his second year of school, Lawson (paired with future first-round pick Ian Cole) helped guide the Fighting Irish to the NCAA National Championship Game, falling to Boston College 4-1. Lawson was named to the All-Tournament Team for his contributions that year. Another good sign for Lawson is that he had a +38 rating throughout his college career.
Lawson stands up well at the blueline, works hard in the corners and boasts solid all-around play in front of the net. Can play a physical game but tends to set the tempo by controlling the puck and angling opponents. Though a bit shorter than ideal for a defensemen at the NHL level, Lawson plays with a lot of poise and provides offensive flair from the back end. --- Hockey's Future
The Hurricanes were also excited when a trade with the NY Rangers landed Bobby Sanguinetti with the organization. Sanguinetti was a first-round pick by the Rangers in 2006 and sources all claim that he has been blessed with the talent of knowing when to jump in on the rush. Another offensive defenseman, Rutherford and certainly coach Paul Maurice were hoping to see what Sanguinetti could do at the NHL level last season, but a hip injury caused him to miss most of his first season with the Checkers. The Canes expect big things out of Sanguinetti in the next coming years and are hoping that he can stay healthy enough to take a shot at sticking in the NHL.
Finally, the Hurricanes had another gem fall into their laps in the 2009 Draft when they took Boston College defenseman Brian Dumoulin 51st overall. After only one season in college Dumoulin justified himself as he earned a spot on the Hockey East All-Rookie team as well as the Frozen Four All-Tournament Team. Not to mention the fact that he helped his Eagles to a National Championship by posting a +40 rating throughout the season and the playoffs. Dumoulin is tall at 6' 3" but can skate with the fluidity of a shorter player. He is dependable in his defensive zone and is also very creative when on the attack. His passing and playmaking skills are second to none at his level. This American seems to have all the goods to be a steady NHL defenseman in the near future.
Combining all of this young talent with current NHL regulars like Derek Joslin (24), Joni Pitkanen (27 - if he re-signs), Tim Gleason (28) and Jamie McBain (23), helps the Hurricanes stay competitive in the present and the future. If his prospects pan out the way that many think they will, then Rutherford has created a monster-in-the-making.
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I hate to be the human bucket of cold water, but that list scares the daylights out of me. Every one of those players, with the possible exceptions of Lawson and Dumoulin, play similar games, and I saw enough of a Faulk-Sanguinetti pairing in the AHL playoffs to give me nightmares. Every time they were out on the ice it was like a Chinese fire drill, and Binghamton in particular took full advantage of their defensive shortcomings.
Not that I’m upset that we got Murphy, far from it. Anytime you can get top-10 talent outside the top 10 you have to do it. But at some point, the defensemen on the Canes’ roster need to be able to play defense too. Regardless of any realignment proposals, the chances are nearly 100% that the Canes will be facing Stamkos and Ovechkin for the next umpteen years, and if your defense has six versions of Phil Housley on the roster chances are you’re going to be forced to win games 8-6.
Look at the Bruins – their shutdown pairing of Chara and Seidenberg performed as advertised against the Sedins in the final. Not that every team can easily develop a Chara, but c’mon, there are Seidenberg clones floating around out there that are a dime a dozen. You can’t tell me that it’s impossible for the Canes to sign one of them to pair with Gleason. Just sayin’.
Tim Gleason was originally projected as an offensively minded guy.
These things can change with coaching. Having a bunch of talented young defensemen who all fit the same bill is a problem Im glad the canes have
by Iggy Reilly on Jun 28, 2011 11:03 AM EDT up reply actions
I hate cliches, but “you can’t teach size” is an apt one. I’m not saying every shutdown guy has to be eight feet tall, but if you’re amassing a collection of undersized puck-moving types coming out of junior, don’t be surprised when they continue to be undersized puck-moving types in the NHL. I’d think that the Nathan Hortons and Ryan Keslers and Rick Nashes of the world would love nothing more than to face a team whose “shutdown pairing” consists of a couple of 6’1", 195-ish guys.
I just really, really worry that JR is putting too many eggs in the same basket. I hope I’m wrong.
by Brian LeBlanc on Jun 28, 2011 11:16 AM EDT up reply actions
To be clear, l agree we DO need a shutdown type of D, I just don’t think JR is interested in drafting one.
I think that is going to come the FA/Trade route.
by Iggy Reilly on Jun 28, 2011 11:23 AM EDT up reply actions
Yep, I do too. See my post below in the Schenn conversation.
by Brian LeBlanc on Jun 28, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Not to mention. We will always have some head room cap wise and there’s always FA big D men out there. I am a huge fan of stay at home D-men, I watch the defense more than the offense ( except for Jeffrey ), but I see this group as being pretty good if you sprinkle in a couple older big men via free agency (when they get called up mind you.) And there’s another point, while I’m at it. These guys are all over the board age/experience wise. They probably won’t all be on the same roster at all times.
Satan is just a coping mechanism for monotheists.
worst case scenario is we end up with a handful of solid PMD’s to move as trade chips. Everyone know how hot a commodity PMD’s are.
Exactly
There is more value right in the NHL right now on puck moving, offensive defensemen. That’s good because if these guys develop, we can keep the best and trade for defensive defensmen straight up. But not all of these guys are only offensive defensemen.
Youll probably see Dumoulin is more defensively responsible and is at least a good two way defenseman if not more defensive than offensive—plus he has the ability to get the weight with his frame—think Glen Wesley, who came in as an offensive guy then became a steady, dependable defensive guy with adequate physicality.
Faulk will also be a little bigger and more physical than Corvo but with better offensive skills. He needs to learn defense against the AHL guys, then again against NHL guys, but he will be a good learner—they don’t come out of the USNDP as one way players. At worst Faulk will be at least as good as Corvo defensively, but probably will mature to be less error prone.
Joslin has size and grit, and could be a good defensive defenseman with work with Wesley, but with the ability to at least control the puck and provide a scoring threat from the back end. While not as offensive minded as the other younger guys, he doesn’t shy away from getting the puck out of the zone or to the opponent’s net.
Alt is big, physical, but needs a lot of work, isn’t an offensive Dman. Neither is Lowe. But neither are they pylons. We don’t have the giants, with the exception of possibly Dumoulin, no 220 pounders on the horizon, but I wouldn’t say we’ve got a bunch of goal scoring, goal allowing guys lined up to play for us either….
I don’t think it’s fair to access Faulk or Sanguinetti based on the end of the season in Charlotte. Faulk was just making the transition to the pro gram with teammates he doesn’t know, and Sanguinetti was so rusty coming off the hip surgery that he was scratched from playoff games.
IMO, Lawson isn’t going to make it. Not bad for a 7th, but I’m surprised he couldn’t carve a spot in Charlotte this year. Also, there are some defensive-minded guys in the system. Speaking of late-round picks, Jeff Daniels is really high on Bellemore. Is he going to be a top-pairing guy? No … but he could be a reliable, Andrew Alberts type.
Dumoulin has the potential to be a real home run. He’s not going to know many guys on their cans, but he’s rangy in his own end and has some offensive chops. Levi is going to be a good stay-at-home guy as well … he’s under the radar, but they’re excited about him as well. Plus Alt and Biega are both big, strong guys that will make a run at the NHL. Through is Rissanen, who is a tough SOB, and Krueger, who is a solid stay-at-home guy, and there’s a lot of potential on the D even beyond the top three or four guys.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 11:11 AM EDT up reply actions
Took the words right out of my mouth...
….or some of them. We seem to be so focused on the high-end PMD talent we’re amassing that we forget about the 5 or so “big guys” we also have in the sytem. Cory pointed out most of them, but it bears repeating…Biega is a muscular freak and at 6’ or 6’1" and over 200 lbs, he will clear the crease. Alt is 6’2" or 6’3" and 200 lbs, Levi is big and fast, Kvisto and Rissanen – both big and solid. We’ve got the “stay at home” types in the system and given that two or more (in addition to Lawson and Krueger, who is a pretty big guy as well) will likely be in Charlotte next year, they are on track for 2012 or shortly thereafter.
So if the issue is “we need size now”, to me it feels like a one year band aid thing…if we don’t believe that one of these guys is ultimately a top pairing guy, well that’s a different story. I’m all for going after a top pairing guy, but I’d be happy to try and muscle through w/a short term fix as well.
Every D prospect we have other than Murphy, Faulk, and Dumoulin will be lucky to ever make the NHL for an extended time. Much less be top-4 material.
Any of them will be lucky to make it. It’s the NHL … it’s not an easy thing to do. But let’s not act like we can look into the future and know who will develop best. You can’t go by where players were picked alone. None of the Norris finalists were first round picks.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 1:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Murphy, Faulk, Dumoulin, McBain, and Gleason are a solid core for the future but I agree that we need. #1 shutdown guy. At this point Id even be fine width McBain being traded for one if he was good enough. Luke Schenn is a perfect example of the type of D we need to build around. There are some very good D in next years Draft that also fit that role.
Schenn’s a mess, IMO. He was rushed.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 11:14 AM EDT up reply actions
seriously, how much of Schenn have you really seen? He’s only 21 and played for a pretty bad team the past 3 seasons. How many 21 year olds play 22/game against the other teams top forwards, of course he’s not going to have great stats.
Apparently not enough this season, didn’t realize he had upped his game that much.
And sometimes it is easy to forget how young some of these guys are who make the jump to the NHL at 18/19
by Iggy Reilly on Jun 28, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
Led D in the league for hits and had near the most blocked shots. Perfect shutdown D, in my opinion.
I think that’s what forget about him, you can’t quantify what he does by looking at his stat line – he doesn’t put a lot of points and his +/- is never going to be that great because of who he plays against. You watch him play a half a dozen it’s pretty hard not to appreciate what he brings – very Gleason like but with probably more upside.
You just said you can’t look at his stat line and quantify what he’s done, and then pointed to his hit and blocked shot stats.
I watched him plenty, and he improved over two seasons ago, but he’s still on the ice for a TON of goals … 33 more than any d-man on the Leafs. He makes simple mistakes … mistkaes that can be expected of a 21-year-old d-man, but mistakes nonetheless. They’re glaring enough, IMO, that it makes me question his future as a top shutdown D. A lot of people rail on Gleason for mistakes, but his are nowhere near the level/number of Schenn’s. Yes, Gleason’s older, more experienced .. but he also isn’t supposed to be the “next great shutdown defender.”
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 12:49 PM EDT up reply actions
to qualify: stat line usually refers to main stats they point out in the game summary (goals, assist, pts. and ice time) that’s all I meant; you typically have to dig a little deeper to find blocked shots and hits. I’d say hardly a mess, probably rushed is fair, but none of their dmen have played well. Have Bogosian, Pietrangelo, and Doughty developed so much better or does the team/city/coaches have anything to do with it. Who’s really flourished in Toronto over the past 20 years, is it coincedence they just fired the asst coaches. I’m not a Gleason hater, but I still think Schenn will have a better career.
Schenn is just now adjusting to the NHL. He was rushed and was not ready for the jump at 18. He looks pretty good now considering the team he plays for..
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by Lee Phillips on Jun 28, 2011 11:31 AM EDT up reply actions
The point’s well-taken, but I agree that Schenn would be too big of a question mark to make a run for.
I also don’t think this is a problem that can be solved through the draft. These guys are going to be here sooner rather than later. The Canes don’t have four years or so to wait for a crease-crasher to get NHL-ready. McBain is already up, Faulk is a year or so away, Dumoulin and one of either Alt or Biega is probably a year behind Faulk. The timeline just doesn’t work to wait until some hypothetical player develops to NHL-caliber. (Probably meaning one of these guys is likely to get moved out in a deal at some point, but there’s no telling who or when.)
by Brian LeBlanc on Jun 28, 2011 11:24 AM EDT up reply actions
Agree and Add
I like Cory’s and your analysis.
Just would add what about Joslin and Allen? Joslin is young and certainly has size to develop into shutdown if its size that is the critical factor. Allen is older, but certainly has size. I would be interested in what are goals against were after acquiring these two versus before we got them. Does anyone have any idea?
by FoxtrotSierra on Jun 28, 2011 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Allen, IMO, was a bit of a disappointment. He could’ve been a foil to Joni, but it never seemed to work out. Maybe that changes with a training camp of working together (if Joni re-signs).
Joslin is a wild card … we need to see more of him. There’s potential.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 12:54 PM EDT up reply actions
Not a foil … bad choice of words … complement.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 12:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Allen was a mistake. Makes more than anyone else on our D currently and played the least average minutes last year. Was only getting about 15 a night. Less than like likes of Joslin.
Take A Look At Some Stats
The Hurricanes gave up 3.06 goals per game while Allen was NOT a member of the team or not playing. They gave up 3.12 goals per game in games that Joslin did not play. In games that Allen played (19) the team gave up 46 goals for an average of 2.42 goals per game and Allen was a net plus 4 for the 19 games. In the games that Joslin played (17) the team gave up 36 goals for an average of 2.12 goals per game and Joslin was a net plus 7 for the 17 games,
If these stats mean anything, it would appear that we were much better defensively with them in the lineup and that they may have added the physical presence that we all believe the team needs on defense.
by FoxtrotSierra on Jun 28, 2011 1:45 PM EDT up reply actions
Strongly disagree about Allen. He has his limitations but made a huge difference for the better most of the time that he was on the ice. He could clear the crease. He could skate up to somebody that flattened Skinner and tell him there would be dire consequences if that happened again. Both of those things were really important and the Canes weren’t getting them from Babchuk, White, etc.
by curiouscanesfan on Jun 28, 2011 3:21 PM EDT up reply actions
No doubt … but he didn’t play up to the $$ he makes. That being said, JR shed the remainder of Samsonov’s deal in the trade. But this year the Canes are straight-up paying him the inflated amount.
A big wild card is how much of a leader Allen can become with a full camp with the team. I don’t think he got to do much of that last season.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 3:33 PM EDT up reply actions
Agree as we used him he wasn’t worth what comparable paid Dmen around the league accomplished. But on this team he added very much needed size, grit, crease clearing and improved our PK immensely. He brought the so called intangibles by making us tougher to play against.
He is our only 220+ pounder—we were the only team in the league without someone of that size. Our GA went down, our PK percentage went up. He made us better and was worth the moneygiven what we had available…
Agree about the $ in absolute terms on the open market, but Allen was really valuable to the Canes because he supplied important things that the Canes otherwise just wouldn’t have. As Elsker pointed out more than once, a key fact about Allen is the term of the contract. Allen is a bridge to the maturing of at least one of the bigger defensive prospects. He’ll probably be gone and if he’s staying it won’t be at the current rate unless his knees find the fountain of youth. If Allen were a little bit more mobile, he would be an extremely valuable defenseman. As it is, he fills critical needs that others can fill – but not others under contract to the Canes.
by curiouscanesfan on Jun 28, 2011 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Always fine to play Devils Advocate Brian
I really think the Canes have a good mix of offensive and defensive defensemen.
While Murphy and Faulk seem to be pure offense, Sanguinetti and Dumoulin seem pretty reliable defensively. Lawson might be a bit of a long shot, but he seems good in his own zone.
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by Lee Phillips on Jun 28, 2011 11:26 AM EDT up reply actions
What scares me with Dumoulin is the same thing that scares me with Gleason – a jack of all trades, master of none that gets shoehorned into too many situations since he’s passable in all of them and winds up playing 28 minutes a night. If you’re going to call Dumoulin up, he needs a specific role, and if that’s a shutdown role then all the better.
But as we’ve seen, JR has a thing for puck-moving defensemen. I’m just nervous that the role these jack-of-all-trades types will be given is one just like every other defenseman on the Canes roster, which will accomplish nothing. You just can’t have six defensemen on the active roster all doing the exact same thing. It doesn’t work.
by Brian LeBlanc on Jun 28, 2011 11:32 AM EDT up reply actions
I do miss the Jack jack-of-all-trades though (not that Johnson was one, I just couldn’t pass up the pun)
Dumoulin seems pretty different from Gleason IMO. I think we’ve put Timmy in a role that he never expected to be in (our number one shutdown guy). While he is rugged and I certainly wouldn’t want to pick a fight with the guy, I think we rely on him too much. Dumoulin seems like the true hockey-lover’s defensive defenseman that could help Tim with his overall game.
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by Lee Phillips on Jun 28, 2011 11:38 AM EDT up reply actions
Um what is Lindstrom?? Defensive or offensive?? What is Duncan Keith? Sergei Gonchar? Brett Hedican? Zubov? Niedermayer? Wesley? These guys are the definition of Jack of all trades. I’m not saying our prospects will be in this league, but the potential is there, who knows? More importantly, you don’t have to be a big, heavy, non-offensive guy to be a very effective defender in this league…
Right, because offensive-minded defensemen like Joe Corvo have no chance at stopping Ovechkin.
I do see what you’re saying, though. Our D is a little undersized. My hopes are that the team will continue to add big strong defensemen through trades and free agency.
by Sluv on Jun 28, 2011 1:08 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Joni
with Faulk, Murphy and Sanguinetti all in the Canes system…I really don’t see why JR would resign Joni as the already mentioned young guns have plenty of offensive power, and probably won’t be afraid to shoot the puck rather then pass all the time like Mr. Joni
use that money elsewhere.
Most of these guys will need 2-3 years of development before rushing to the NHL. I say sign Joni to a 2 year deal and not grossly overpay and hope for the best out of our future guys. Out of any of them, Sanguinetti is the most NHL ready IMO
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by Lee Phillips on Jun 28, 2011 11:20 AM EDT up reply actions
Games without Pitkanen..
were not good ones and his absence form the ice was always felt. Conversely, when he was on the ice, he gobbled up minutes and did things that do not always show up on the stat sheet. His lumbering speed and emotionless demeanor got him tagged as a loafer when it was really not true,. His slap pass first and his oh so readable feed to Jussi on the PP drew some ire from me and others as well. In the end…we need Joni. He is a game changer.
2 years to the Cup
A few other names in the mix – none of which are top-pairing types (as we hope Dumoulin will be), but they would be seen as more shut-down Dmen: Michal Jordan, Justin Kruger, Casey Borer,
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Jun 28, 2011 11:22 AM EDT reply actions
Borer played well in his short time with the Canes – if not for his injury in the bus crash I think he would be playing for us permanently with us
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by Lee Phillips on Jun 28, 2011 11:30 AM EDT up reply actions
And the knee injury before that … hard-luck kid.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 12:51 PM EDT up reply actions
Having your hockey career sunk by a broken neck in a bus accident when you were in no way responsible for the wreck is pretty unlucky. And wasn’t the injury at first misdiagnosed, delaying the surgery required to fix it? Borer has been rebuilding his health and skills in the AHL when he otherwise would probably have been a solid bottom-pairing defenseman for the Canes for a couple of years. That’s pretty unlucky.
by curiouscanesfan on Jun 28, 2011 8:10 PM EDT up reply actions
Thought of 4 more defensive dmen in the till: Rissanen, Kivisto, Tyler Stahl, and Austin Levi – Levi is attending USA Hockey’s WJC-20 camp in August. IIRC, Rissanen looked pretty good (though not consistently) for Team Finland’s U-20 WJC group last January.
None are Shea Weber/Ryan Suter, but when paired w/ top-tier PMD’s you’d think somebody in there will make the jump. (faulty logic, but at some point)
Harrison, Joslin, Allen? And Cory already mentioned Mark Alt.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Jun 28, 2011 12:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Yep, it’s front loaded.
6.5 million this year and 4 for the follow ones
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by Lee Phillips on Jun 28, 2011 11:33 AM EDT up reply actions
Recent tweet from @DarrenDreger implies Erik Cole is the FA we aren’t close to signing anymore.
“Carolina would like to re-sign Erik Cole, but it doesn’t sound like the two sides are close at the moment. However, these things turn quickly”
In years past, this is where JR implements his Strong Pimp Hand (Wyshysnki’s term, from July 2009 the last time these two danced this dance).
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Jun 28, 2011 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
And Thanks to @caniac176 for recalling that for me.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Jun 28, 2011 12:14 PM EDT up reply actions
if we recall last time he was a UFA, his strategy was to make himself available come July 1st and if no one made him a big offer he would take the Canes offer, I expect the same.
Yeah I don’t find this surprising at all.
I’m more HOPING that this means that Jussi/Joni are still on board.
by Iggy Reilly on Jun 28, 2011 12:15 PM EDT up reply actions
Difference is he’s several years removed from “the neck” and he’s coming off of the 2nd best statistical year of his professional career….and anybody who watched him understands that Erik truly does bring intangibles through his “bull in the china shop” offensive play….oh yeah, he still throws some decent hits, not as many, but he’s still a “power forward” in the prototypical definition of the word.
Ryan Murphy is on 99.9 with Mike Maniscalco right now. I’ll post a link if it goes up later.
Twitter @HMof2
by Carolyn Christians on Jun 28, 2011 12:42 PM EDT reply actions
No point in claiming him off waivers … it’s more than $3M for next year. If they wanted to take a run at him, better to let him be bought out and try to sign him as a UFA. But I’d say stay away.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 1:31 PM EDT up reply actions
Minnesota picks up half at this point if he is taken by someone, yes? Cory, I don’t see him much but am curious as to why you would stay away?
by Canes Pucknut on Jun 28, 2011 1:36 PM EDT up reply actions
He’s a bust. Slow, soft and hasn’t shown any of the offensive flair that made him the third overall pick in Raleigh.
by Cory Lavalette on Jun 28, 2011 2:46 PM EDT up reply actions
Hockey's Future Thinks Highly of Cam Barker
Here’s the link to Hockeys’ Future analysis of Cam Barker:
http://www.hockeysfuture.com/prospects/cam_barker
I disagree with your assessment of Barker. I agree he is underachieving. He hurt his back this season after being traded. He is a player who could, but might not, develop into a superb defenseman. At present, he hasn’t come close to reaching his potential.
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